News investigates JW Sex offender going door-to-door

//News investigates JW Sex offender going door-to-door

KOAA.com | Continuous News | Colorado Springs and Pueblo
COLORADO SPRINGS –

66-year-old Waymon Ivery is reliving a nightmare that happened more than two decades ago. Sitting in the KOAA studio conference room, he admitted his regret.

“I had no idea — no clue as to the effect that it would have,” Ivery said, referring to the pain he inflicted upon his 9-year-old stepdaughter that he was convicted of molesting in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, in 1992.

Fourteen years later, Ivery’s conviction has gained local attention among citizens of Colorado Springs. A local group of Jehovah’s Witnesses, knowing his past, allowed Ivery to go door-to-door on behalf of the group.

His case recently reentered the public eye after a man named Roman Vargas approached Ivery with a video camera. He surprised him with a question about a crime for which he served nearly a year in prison, after being sentenced to 10 years.

Just hours after the video began to make the rounds on YouTube, Ivery was reliving what he thought was ancient history.

Commenters on social media websites began to make their opinions public. One person wrote: “This cult’s days are numbered.” Another wrote “JW’s and child protection issues just don’t seem to mix well. What is the matter with them?”

The public’s concerns prompted News 5 Investigates to make several calls and emails to the world headquarters of Jehovah’s Witnesses, located in New York. All went unanswered. News 5 also contacted elders within the group locally, who also never responded with more information. The next step was to reach out directly to the people who go door-to-door.

We found them knocking on the doors of Lazy Lane Circle in northeast Colorado Springs. They were not too happy to see us, and told us that we should follow the instructions on their website. They slammed their mini van’s door on our cameras.

We decided to speak to a resident of the street who had been approached by two women affiliated with the group just moments before.

”Do I think such a person would drag off a minor member of my family?” local resident and lawyer Peter Conroy said. “I think it’s highly unlikely, but it’s always possible.” However, Conroy later said he thinks Ivery deserves a second chance at life at some point, if he is making the effort to turn his life around.

Ivery served time behind bars and by all accounts has led a law abiding life ever since. But local residents are concerned that Jehovah’s Witnesses allow Ivery to approach strangers’ homes, while he has been asked to keep his distance when it comes to the church. Church procedure says Ivery is not allowed to hold a position of leadership in his own church, such as minister to children or Elder.

Why would the congregation allow such a policy within the church, but also allow Ivery to freely walk through strangers’ neighborhoods on behalf of their group? Many comments on Vargas’ Youtube video said the policy is hypocritical.

News 5 Investigates visited Ivery’s home in the Springs to request an interview. He initially declined, but two days later, he agreed to come to the KOAA Studios to share his story.

He began the interview by saying he was doing this because he “felt like dirt,” and that his talking to us may help others abstain from acting on their urges. Those urges, he said, were brought on by post-traumatic stress disorder after serving in the military.

But after serving his time for the crime, and after seeing an episode on the Oprah Winfrey Show about child molestation, ”A light went off in my head,” Ivery said, and he now takes full responsibility. “What I did was extremely wrong.”

When News 5 asked Ivery why he thought Jehovah’s Witnesses would allow him to go door-to-door with full knowledge of his past, he said, “They allow this because they have a safety net in place. I have not gone door to door by myself. It’s a policy of the witnesses.”

The Jehovah’s Witnesses policy says that witnesses may never approach a home without at least one other person. But our interview with Ivery has raised more questions. Who could be knocking on your door next? Could it be someone with a questionable past?

“Some people that have been committed of crimes that I committed have more restrictions on them than I do,” Ivery said.

Source – KOAA 5 

2016-12-08T15:09:57+00:00 August 28th, 2016|JW News|219 Comments
  • At the end, the news reporter said that he was waiting for jw headquarters to get back with him. Hahaha
    That is definitely never going to happen.
    And a convicted sex offenders should never be able to go door to door. NEVER

    • Sam

      The organization of love slams its doors in the face of the enquiring public, i love it! (Wish that was the headline lol) in fact the specific instruction for those cart witnessing is just that, don’t provide a witness just direct to the magic website. Today’s wt covers how we shouldn’t let Joe publisher’s actions stumble us from serving Jehovah. But when are the org and the brothers up top ever called to account for stumbling and causing ones to lose faith? Surely that is much more prevalent than brother so and so who didn’t hold the door open for someone at the hall

    • ewatchman

      Did you notice that the convicted pedophile said he won’t go out knocking on doors any more because he didn’t want to disturb people. So, he has more decency then the Governing Body, or whoever makes up these policies and promotes this kind of evil.

      • I did notice that, and I was very impressed with his concern. His Hall probably had no idea of his transgressions.

        • Joel

          He probably is a very nice Brother….clueless…but nice nonetheless.

        • Basavaraj Of North Karnataka

          Nice comment

      • Revv_zone@gmail.com Please8834

        . I didn’t see anything about him saying he wouldn’t go door to door anymore. He actually said he wouldn’t go to a door by himself ..

      • NWOBS9014

        I’m starting to not like your tone toward’s the Governing Body and I’m considering not to click on your links again and unsubscribe, Your comment seems very apostate, If there is to be punishment for the Governing Body then leave it to Jehovah not your website.More over, This pedophile knew before he went out into field service that he could bring reproach on Jehovah’s Holy name, now look now we all have to live with his shame. If it where up to me, and it’s not unfortunately, No known pedophile/rapist or murderer would be allowed to go door to door for that very reason, they can do other work for Jehovah, Period, They chose their sin not the congregation so now let Jehovah decide.

      • NWOBS9014

        I’m starting to not like your tone toward’s the Governing Body and I’m considering not to click on your links again and unsubscribe, Your comment seems very apostate, If there is to be punishment for the Governing Body then leave it to Jehovah not your website.More over, This pedophile new before he went out into field service that he could bring reproach on Jehovah’s Holy name, now look, we all have to live with his shame. If it where up to me, and it’s not unfortunately, No known pedophile/rapist or murderer would be allowed to go door to door for that very reason, they can do other work, Period, They chose their sin not the congregation so now let Jehovah decide.

      • NWOBS9014

        I’m starting to not like your tone toward’s the Governing Body and I’m considering not to click on your links again and unsubscribe, Your comment seems very apostate, If there is to be punishment for the Governing Body then leave it to Jehovah not your website.More over, This pedophile new before he went out into field service that he could bring reproach on Jehovah’s Holy name, now look, we all have to live with his shame. If it were up to me, and it’s not unfortunately, No known pedophile/rapist or murderer would be allowed to go door to door for that very reason, they can do other work, Period, They chose their sin not the congregation so now let Jehovah decide.

        • Kevin b

          Roberts tone toward the GB has been quite consistent throughout the years. I can’t imagine any regular readers here being offended by his comment. If you want to examine Roberts comments, or call what he said apostate, you can, it’s a free country for now. But your comments on other disqus you belong too, are very questionable for a Christian. So don’t come on here like it’s your job to defend the GB, and what Robert said was wrong. Robert stated a fact, “He has more decency then the Governing Body, or whoever makes up these policies and promotes this kind of evil.” Fact. You were offended by that? Really?

          • POW!
            Drop the mike

          • NWOBS9014

            OOOHH so we have another apostate in here do we.

            • Kevin b

              Wow, name calling, what are you 5? You sound like a Watchtower magazine throughing out the “A” word. Jesus was an apostate to the Jews. We are all apostate in the eyes of some. I only care about how Jehovah and Jesus view me, and I doubt their view of me is that of an apostate. Your opinion of me means nothing at all. Most of us here have Roberts back, I know I do. If I were you, I’d keep that idolization of the GB to a minimum, it will get you nowhere.

            • NWOBS9014

              OK you win, you can stop trolling me now!

            • Joel

              Well said my brother!

            • The kid has returned to the mother ship, was unable to handle the truth about the truth. Was beamed up at o-nine-hundred. And he was just starting to grow out his ministerial mustache.

            • Kevin b

              You have to love that governing body approved well trimmed mustache.

            • It’s a requirement, can’t carry the mike if you don’t have the stache!

            • Burt Reynolds

              You are allowed a moustache now?!!! I have plainly been asleep. I used to have a handlebar moustache when I was a ms, plus tailored flares, a leather trench coat and boots. No one said a word. Perhaps I was the cause of this go backlash about facial hair. I was quite groovy for a JW. I was about six foot four in my boots and no, they did not have soles a foot thick! I only got to do the mic on one occasion as I recall, but I used to read the watchtower quite often at the Sunday meetings. When they made me an ms, I was given the hall garden/trash pit to look after, so I spent all the donations on doing it up. They made me magazine servant pretty quickly after that I can tell you.

            • Kevin b

              A Handlebar mustache won’t cut it here in the states. Has to be well trimmed to have privileges. Who needs privileges anyway. I like the leather trench coat idea, that might just put my brothers over the edge, they already think I could go postal at any minute.

            • Burt Reynolds

              Hitler had a very well trimmed moustache. The ruling, though petty, is just another example of the superficial level of thinking and unreasoned control that the governing body exercise over their subjects. You are right; who wants a position? It’s just a sop to the battered ego for people stripped naked of any self direction, inner respect and ability to think and reason for themselves. A vacuous reward indeed. It brings an added meaning to the term, the truth shall set you free!

            • Kevin b

              I guess he didn’t stand behind what he said about Robert after all. All comments deleted.

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              “Name calling” is a warning sign of abuse…dare I mention the irony of what has occurred in this comment section today?

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              and No, I am not referring to those who defend Brother King and the truth because I would in fact be quilty…

            • Just keep swimming!

              What happened here? I swam away for a day and “guest” or NWOB was name-calling? Ugh, that’s a bummer. I hope he/she wakes up to reality…I truly hope the best for everyone. Hey Robert!…when’s the next podcast? Perhaps do a clip on YOUR observations re whether you’ve noticed more “alertness” in general in the JW community. For a person only aware of e-watchman for less than a year, how would you describe what’s going on? Like the helicopter newsman reporting on traffic. We’re only on the ground and it seems like more traffic…is there?

            • The Governing Body is not going to sit idly by while the revealing, that is, exposing of them and their sins and errors is progressing. They blame apostates for they have not come to understand that the revealing is from Jehovah; and therefore they see no need to repent and humble themselves. But was it any different in Jeremiah’s time? (Jer. 1:17-19) Has Jehovah not always given the wicked the opportunity to repent and thus escape any judgment foretold to come upon them? (Isaiah 3:12-14; Ezek. 33:11) Rather than fight against those whom they would label apostates for speaking the truth, they should take to heart Gamaliel’s wise words: “So my advice is, leave these men alone. Let them go. If they are planning and doing these things merely on their own, it will soon be overthrown. But if it is from God, you will not be able to overthrow them. You may even find yourselves fighting against God!” —Acts 5:38,39, NLT

        • Just keep swimming!

          I don’t understand why you feel brother Robert is sounding “apostate.” Of course you are entitled to your feelings, but I wonder why. Please consider 1 Samuel 2:24 (and context) . Isn’t ewatchman being loving for being open, truthful, and honest about the state of affairs so we can make better choices? The truth does set us free! Would you have told Jeremiah or Ezekiel or Isaiah or the other servants of Jehovah to be quiet because you didn’t like their message? I’m happy you feel comfortable expressing your concerns….I felt confused at first when I found this site….you were searching for “coherence” too no doubt? We are brothers and sisters here. I hope you find some peace.

          • NWOBS9014

            Robert King came down pretty hard with his comment on the Governing Body, maybe by him being one of the anointed gives him leeway, I couldn’t talk like that in public about Jehovah’s Organized Earthly Kingdom even if I felt they are wrong or not.

            • Just keep swimming!

              I hear you…but that’s not Robert or any of us scolding you….that’s fear of man (GB). That should tell you something. The fact that ALL of us get so vocal when it comes to this pedophile junk shows we care. Why isn’t the GB getting as vocal? I think the count for the $4,000 a day fine is approaching 1/4 million dollars. … JW donations.

            • Joel

              Excellent point JKS!

              We here, posting our thoughts and opinions on this E-Watchman site, at times we seem like we have more ZEAL and OUTRAGE at this criminal pedophilia smut than the Governing Body! And in truth, I think we do!!!

            • Burt Reynolds

              A quarter of a million?! That is some display of stubbornness. I suppose they are reckoning that it’s cheaper than the cases that will follow the production of the evidence, but that is a shortsighted view as one way or another it will come out. Nothing will remain hidden. What a flippant use of brothers donations. Scandalous. At least your profile picture is of a pretty fish swimming in clean water. I will wait to see what the governing body end up swimming in,…..but it won’t be nice, and it won’t be clean.

            • Sam

              Not that I resent it but I’d say your comment on the man mentioned in this article was much more heated than any comment I’ve seen Robert make towards the GB. And if you think they are above critism then maybe you are putting too much stock in men. I would say that is more dangerous. It’s funny though, you ripped the paedophile a new one when in fact the GB’s policies and stubbornness is what allows this to happen. Jehovah’s words towards his appointed people in times past through prophecy totally fit the leadership today, so I would say one cannot be apostate for echoing his words

            • ewatchman

              I am glad you feel that way.

        • Bethel knowingly allows pedophiles to lurk without alerting parents in the congregations, this is a HUGE problem and a gross breech of their fiduciary responsibility.
          The question really comes down to this: How valuable is the life and wellbeing of a single child? What do you suppose Jesus Christ would say in answer to that question?

          • ELiJAHxSEVEN

            You can expect that deeply ingrained mechanism to be triggered when discussing anything negative against the gb and the watchtower…at one time I had that defensive mental block and I had to overcome the brainwash and denial…some will try and protect the “mother ship” at all cost, even when Christ comes to rid it of the evil slave…I am inclined to defend Brother King and those who love and speak the truth from their hearts, rather than defend those who are betraying Christ and our fellow sheep…Brother King needs no defense, he has Jehovah on his side and thats the truth!

            • Kevin b

              Wow! It’s nice to see someone who gets its. “Mother ship” I love it.

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              I had an elder tell me that he has a tendency to defend the org like his own mother…it seems to be a common theme!

            • Kevin b

              I feel it’s truly sad how the organization has such a hold on the brothers and sisters. They are 100% sure that being loyal to Jehovah is the exact same as being loyal to Watchtower. How wrong they really are.

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              “To test their love of the truth”….sadly, not all will pass that test

            • Ed(the other Ed)

              I think it’s mostly the hard core society people who will fall into this trap

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              I think about the many who would rather just follow blindly those blind leaders because they do not want to question or think for themselves…the Pied Piper of Hamelin comes to mind

            • Ed(the other Ed)

              yeah I know what you mean. I guess I’m fortunate to be born with a defiant streak in me, not good at taking orders very well.

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              Same here..lol…perhaps we are just in defiance to illogical and incoherent mandates from those who try and “lord it over” us?…Most likely the case

            • Ed(the other Ed)

              probably true, and I come from a family of cops on my dads side stemming back 100 years, that might have something to do with it to, I was taught to be a little suspicious of everything and I couldn’t follow in his footsteps because of my defiance. Not that I wanted to.

            • Burt Reynolds

              It’s a psychological kudos thing…almost unbreakable in terms of reasoning. It’s the ‘blindness’ we so often refer to. Strong enough to make people lay down their lives as we saw in the patriotism of the Great War when ordinary people went off to kill and maime for King and country, who, incidentally, started it. The combatants were called cannon fodder, and you could say the same of Satan, sending these blind followers off into the day of Jehovah to be slaughtered. It makes you wonder if indeed we are in control of our own minds.

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              I concur, the psychosis of the masses, appears to be on par with demonic possession…I don’t feel that comparison is farfetched….The one who endures to the end will have to guard their spiritual mind by tightly wearing the helmet of salvation in battle against the opposing demonic forces…It is very much a battle for the ability to keep ones sanity!

          • Burt Reynolds

            You remind me of that scripture that not one sparrow falls to earth without Jehovah knowing….how much more valuable then, are you? It’s the innocence of the child that is murdered, along with the soul….the mental makeup. I didn’t see what the guest wrote and it seems to have been deleted, but I expect what ever it was, was well intentioned.

            • Yeah he wasn’t able to take the heat, (NWOBS) and was being self-righteous. Also Kevin B,busted him on other sites using bad language. So he deleted his account and in turn all his comments. Oh well, win some and you lose some.

            • Kevin b

              I didn’t try to run him off. Just tried to adjust his thinking. I hope he comes back and continues his search for the truth. Just don’t come on here saying people are apostates. Maybe some People need to learn more about what this site is all about before they start commenting. And please don’t say Robert sounds like an apostate for stating the obvious about the GB. For personal selfish reasons I hope Robert is around for a while, But when he does receive his heavenly calling, it would be interesting to see how the GB members that actually receive the heavenly hope interact with the “apostate” Robert King. Talking about jaws dropping when they notice Robert next to Jesus and he give them a wink and a nod. Sorry sometimes my imagination gets the best of me, but that would be sweet wouldn’t it.

            • I don’t think you ran him off, he obviously has some growing up to do yet. I love the fact that he was all self righteous, but if you looked at his comments it told a different story. Typical young jw.

            • Burt Reynolds

              I’m sure he will have a wonderful ‘experience’ to relate and have his 15 minutes in the limelight at the congregation.

        • Volcanic

          only two days ago you said “Robert King has more inspired wisdom and knowledge in his little pinky finger then all the anointed governing body combined,”…….. It isn’t necessary to berate Bro Robert for his well balanced article, I’m certain if it were me writing it there would be a few more very ‘choice’ words in there!

          Are you angry because of the GB policy or the pedophile going on field service? Your comment here of 4 hours ago suggests that you are very angry with the pedophile himself – are we to assume that maybe there has been a problem in that area for you or one of your loved ones, NWOB? If so, then you have all our prayers of help & support for you.

          Regardless, it seems the accused has served his time & has been leading a ‘clean life’ since, so surely some forgiveness must be in order, for Jehovahs sake, if nothing else, a vile crime as it was, it was an isolated incident apparently! There are many worse within the congregations, I’m sure they bring far more reproach on Jehovahs name.

          However, whatever your reasons for being angry, it is quite easy not to click onto this site again, you just sit on your hands, but I’m certain that you are quite a loving person really & would miss us & we you 🙂

          • Joel

            You go girl, er, I mean Sis!!!

            • Volcanic

              *girl* suits me, Joel 😉

            • Joel

              Very good!!! Lol!

          • NWOBS9014

            My earlier comment about Robert King still go’s, He is beyond belief when comes to scripture knowledge. As far as forgiving the pedophile, Yes I can do that until he acts likes a moron and go’s out into a world that won’t forgive him for what he did and he shames Jehovah’s name, That’s where I draw the line with these idiots.

        • ewatchman

          I am not advocating that anyone harm or punish the Governing Body. This website is all about leaving the punishment to Jehovah. I am in fact certain that punishment will soon be forthcoming.

          But, the Governing Body have the ultimate responsibility when it comes to who is allowed to go out in service. Everyone publisher is vetted and must be approved beforehand, beginning as an unbaptized publisher. So, to imply that it is all on the pedophile is absurd.

        • Bklyn Kevin

          Response to email comment.

          Excerpt:

          Paul did not shrink from confronting the evil by claiming that doing so would bring reproach on Jehovah or go against his arrangement.
          That being so, a question you might consider is this: If the apostle were alive today would he refrain from condemning the Watchtower’s policies that have directly contributed to allowing pedophiles to abuse children?
          After all, the sexual immorality that Paul exposed was at least between consenting adults. Should we imagine the apostles of Christ would commend an organization that maintains a secret database of over 20,000 known child abusers, and which instructs its elders not to cooperate with the police or courts when it comes to investigating and prosecuting crimes that have been perpetrated by Jehovah’s Witnesses against innocent children?
          An even better question to ponder is, ought we to imagine that Jehovah is pleased with such policies on the part of those who have been entrusted with God’s precious sheep?

          Here is something else to consider: Is it really just a matter of human imperfection when intelligent men sit around a boardroom table and formulate and enforce policies over years and years, which are known by them to be harmful? Is it really honest to dismiss such wickedness as mere human imperfection? And if the Society’s policies are not evil why do they secretly pay out millions in donated funds to abuse victims?

          And while it is nice that some of Jehovah’s Witnesses leave the kingdom hall and return home to happy families, what about the thousands of families that have been devastated by child abuse perpetrated by predators lurking within the congregation? What about all of those who have been stumbled by the Watchtower’s wicked doings? Does Jehovah care at all? Is there to be a day of reckoning?.
          Read more>
          https://e-watchman.com/response-to-email-comment201384response-to-email-
          commentresponse-to-email-comment/

          Is e-Watchman an Apostate Site?.
          Excerpt:
          e-Watchman does not reject the leadership of Jehovah’s Witnesses as being representatives of Jehovah. On the contrary, I recognize the organization as belonging to God. But Israel and later Judah served in the same capacity in order to fulfill God’s purpose towards them. And because God recognized them as being bound by a covenant with him God used various men as prophets to issue warnings and denunciations.

          The leadership of the Watchtower has fallen into the same pattern of arrogance and faithlessness as the kings and priests before Christ.

          Read more>

          https://e-watchman.com/is-e-watchman-an-apostate-site/

          Search results for: Policies.
          https://e-watchman.com/?s=Policies&lang=en

          .

      • Joel

        . . . the Service desk of Bethel.

      • this world is sad. i hope Jehovah fixes him and that man keeps moving forward

      • Basavaraj Of North Karnataka

        Your are 100% right!!! Brother

  • Tamar

    Two witnesses to a door policy?
    Not so! That is only if you are female. Haven’t you seen the new door to door videos when they first started out the new Tuesday night meeting? The females always had a partner, but the males went alone.

    • Daisy

      Too true Tamar…the man said..its a policy of the witnesses in that “they” allow him to go door-to-door because they have a safety net in place that doesn’t allow him to work solo…To me that sounded primed, considering the man initially declined an interview, then agreed two days later…sufficient time to get his story straight with the help of TPTB, elders or bethel…so maybe the society was behind his interview…who knows…

      • Burt Reynolds

        Hello Daisy , I have been distracted this last week or so, but I have not forgotten you. How are you managing, what is happening in your world? I hope there are more positives than negatives. Keep on plodding on. Never give up. Love .

        • Daisy

          Hello Burt dear brother.
          I was in Whitstable today…enjoyed my lunch in a little garden attached to a vegan cafe so I’m up n running…living one day at a time…enjoying summer.
          Starting 2nd cycle of chemo this week & alls running smoothly, no nausea, exhaustion, nothing… Blood platelets normal, liver, kidneys normal – & delicious with a rich wine jus – & even more delicious to be confirmed by experts as normal! Never been told that before.
          So thank you for thinking of me.
          Thanking everyone for thinking of me as I’m proof that all your prayers have helped.
          Love from Daisy. 😀

          • Burt Reynolds

            I have never had anyone call me normal….that won’t surprise you I’m sure. I am so SO pleased for you that all is going well. Your joy in the face of the ultimate adversity is so strengthening and makes my heart glad for you. Keep going.

  • NWOBS9014

    It took Ivery seeing an episode on the Oprah Winfrey Show about child molestation, For ”A light to go off in his head”? Really? Really? Knowing Jehovah wasn’t enough to do it for him? What about his studies of the scriptures? So Oprah is now the awe inspiring authority of morality and truth not Jehovah and His word the bible? Thanks a lot Ivery you bona fide pedophile idiot.

    • Bobby 6343

      The reason it took the Oprah show for the “light” to go on, was because he was only going through the motion at the meetings as do so many. He was at he favorite congregation “social club”!

      Still express through his own words: “I had no idea — no clue as to the effect that it would have,”

      Really? Even after being release from prison, YOU still did not have a “clue”!? You went door to door as if nothing happened?

      Even worst, those in positions of leadership were just like YOU, not having a “clue”?

      As we have learned on this “wonderful site”, “only terror will make them understand.

      The public does not know who is a convicted felon or not. Too bad we here can see it, but those in the congregation or worst “spiritual paradise” will continue to be blissfully ignorant of the facts!

    • Joel

      Here here! Yes, Ivory is a bonofide idiot!

      • NWOBS9014

        Yes, NO, Sarcastic?

  • T L C

    It’s crazy that these news articles are released and witnesses seem to know absolutely nothing about how widespread and public this problem is. They wonder why less and less people are responding to the witnessing work. They imagine it’s because we are even closer to the time of the end and so most who are coming in have already done so. What a rude awakening that will come upon the House of God when he takes action to vindicate His name. I feel for so many of my family members that are oblivious to this…:-(

    • Joel

      You are so right T.L.C.

      The average Brother or sister in the local Congregations are totally, and I do mean TOTALLY in the dark about the pedophilia that is rampant in the JW Organization.

      There is no doubt about it . . . the Governing Body deliberately tries to keep the Brothers in a sort of ‘time warp bubble.’ When the local friends here about some sort of sexual child abuse, they “automatically” relegate such stories to back recesses of their minds; refusing to believe that such things really happen in “Jehovah’s Organization.” They prefer to believe—and the Governing Body puts forth the view—that it is “apostates” or opposers of JW’s that promote such so-called lies.

      How sad that the average Witness knows nothing of the deep problems permeating throughout the whole of the Organization.

      . . .and unfortunately, that’s the way the Governing Body wants it.

      • Volcanic

        Only last week I was telling my JW friend about the pedophiles problem & she denied it saying that the GB are bringing to prosecution the VERY FEW pedophiles within the congregation & making certain that they are imprisoned!!!!! **gulp**

        • ewatchman

          Oh dear. There is clueless. And then there is CLUELESS!

          • Just keep swimming!

            Hey…we’re not allowed to call things that quack ducks here. (Sarcasm)

          • or making up stories

      • T L C

        Yeah…So crazy right??? I remember when the scandal about pedophilia in the Catholic Church came out and how quick witnesses were to condemn. Myself included…I think I was still going back then. But, now that I am on the other side it is pretty disheartening to see these things going on….I can now see why people think the witnesses as being brainwashed.

        • Joel

          Yes T L C! I have often wondered that myself! Are we brainwashed? Lol!

          • T L C

            When I was active I was. LOL. However, if/when I go back I will not be thanks to the enlightenment found on this site. Do you currently go Joel? Or, is that too personal?

    • Just keep swimming!

      The harvest will be suddenly lost….the book of Joel.

      • James

        Fish in the sea die in Revelation.

        • Just keep swimming!

          Lol…I know ..then I can go back to being a person. No more hiding behind aliases!

    • irene evans

      Denial not wanting to face the truth , when i told an elder i cant go door to door any more but i witness on the internet he warned me about apostates…..they are scared of the truth coming out cant remain silent anymore

  • Burt Reynolds

    I think that the anger I read here, and the frustration is justified. However, let me tell you something about child abusers. My children were abused for years. I knew nothing about it and I don’t think I will ever be free of the guilt. I found out who the abuser was and can truthfully say that given the opportunity, I would have exacted a terrible. But I was young and impetuous. The police of course did nothing of any consequence, as this was in the days when there was little public concern. Anyway, I won’t go into detail. The point of my example, is that though we cannot forgive the sin, we are expected to ‘forgive’ the sinner, but then the example is, as Jesus said of the prostitute about to be stoned, ‘let you who is without sin, cast the first stone.’ and to the prostitute, ‘go your way and sin no more.’ Unless we can look objectively as Jesus did on this occasion, that the world is full of sin and the instigator of sin, or the one promulgating the opportunity to sin and the means to do so, such as via pornography and by induced thinking, then we ourselves lack mercy. Jesus knew that his time was not yet. He would have been grieved at the distress to children and families that the prostitute would have connived in with her clients, and also, Jesus saw the distress that would have come upon those would be murderers anxious to kill a defenceless woman for their own gratification and presumed public esteem egged on by the clergy. Though I hounded the man that harmed my children….and I am still repairing his crimes with my children….I now, and they, feel dead inside to his wrongdoing and which is about the best one can hope for. In fact, I feel more sorry for the system that produced him and pray even more for it to wiped away and for cleanliness to be restored, never to rot away again. I do not care if he is shown mercy or not, but I want him to be, because if he did see inside himself, he would come to know of the pain he has caused and it would scar itself upon his soul as a reminder. And also, I know that unless I can forgive him, and indeed myself for not even knowing about it, then who am I to expect mercy from Jesus, from Jehovah? I think for my family that though we can achieve a sort of neutral feeling, neither hating or piously ‘forgiving’ for show as some do, but being realistic in that this is something, a part of the system that we must live with, and protect our children and vulnerable adults from, we will have achieved as much as we can do as sinners ourselves. Now, when this ivery person says the light has gone off in his head, we need to accept that he may have ‘gone his way and sinned no more’, for it is not for us to judge, but that if he did repent, we would need to accept him…..even here….if we are to be true to what the bible teaches. There are both holocaust victims and holocaust perpetrators that have forgiven and been forgiven of. What we are to see in the near future, will make the holocaust pale, and the Russian advance on Berlin seem positively courteous to the thousands of women raped and murdered. We can be indignant, but we need to remain focused on the true balance of what the bible means for us to understand. Forgiveness is not straightforward. It is not an ‘oh sorry brother, I didn’t mean to ….’ No. Unfortunately for us shallow humans (floating in this sea of filth we have made for ourselves), yet deeply rewarding in the fullness of Jehovah’s love for us all, forgiveness costs us and pushes us to examine ourselves for the quality of our forgiveness and to deepen our insight of and to purify the meaning of Jehovah’s love for us through the outworking of our faith in him. I am not of course in anyway excusing the pertinent issues offered here by all, I am just tired of throwing stones without thinking about the example Jesus gave us and what it means.

    • Song of Hannah

      Burt I appreciate what you are saying, only I have a bit of a different view, I’d like to share. I myself was molested as a child for several years, and I have never forgiven the molester. This is because he has never repentantly apologized to me, nor asked my forgiveness. If he had, well then I would do my darn best to forgive him. But then, even Jehovah himself does not forgive unrepentant wrongdoers. And I have not seen anywhere in scripture where he requires it of us. Even in the parable of the slave in Matthew 18, the one owing him money pleaded for leniency, or forgiveness. And the example of “casting the first stone”, if I remember right is an interpolation, and not really part of the Bible canon. And it doesn’t seem like it would be, for why would Jesus fault others for obeying the law Jehovah himself set forth?

      Anyhow, I really do appreciate those who have it within them to forgive the unrepentant – but I am definitely not one of them…

      • Joel

        Very heartfelt, and understandable.

        By the way, you are correct. The “let he who is without sin cast the first stone” verse is an interpolation, not in the original or earliest manuscripts. Good eye Sis!

        • Burt Reynolds

          I didn’t know.

          • Joel

            Yes! Sad to burst the old traditional—yet false—view.

            The Watchtower Society brought that out many years ago; and most, if not all major theological scholaly research books agree.

            So while the ‘let he who is without sin cast the first stone’ quote has been beloved by many, and has been a staple of many popular Jesus movies down through the years—the truth, unfortunately, is that he never said it!

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              But…Jesus did say love covers a multitude of sins…even the most vile sin…we must follow Jesus’s example of love to endure this world of wickedness…Jehovah will indeed “cast a stone” that will crush this disgusting sinfull world!

            • Joel

              Here, here!

            • irene evans

              that may well be true but its a good principle not to judge our fellow man, and it exposes those among us who are self righteous , i gave a witness to a brother regarding the errors of the WT i pointed out that for a number of years Jehovah used the Hebrew nation to fulfill his purpose but disiplined them many times, the brother said the GB is different they are the slave , a case of idolatry he then accused me of being a sinner….are we all not sinners , yes but worse is it to ignore Jehovahs discipline

            • ELiJAHxSEVEN

              Take heart…Jesus will remove ALL things that cause stumbling from his congregation, expose the watchtowers errors, and set matters straight….COMING SOON..at a time we do not expect!

      • Volcanic

        *** big hugs*** xxxxxxx

      • Burt Reynolds

        Yes I agree with you Hannah. I can not put down all points to cover all issues in my comment. That is why I said that all the comments made were justifiable. It is a contradictory matter to which there is no answer. It is very much a personal matter as is any violation, and as happened to me when I was in the army. I am not trying to tell people how they should feel or that they should forgive. As I noted, I myself feel dead inside to the matter, neither one thing or the other. yes, I agree that Jehovah does not extend mercy to those who are unrepentant, but my point was that if they are, then we should respond howsoever that may be distasteful to us because we are unable to forgive in the depths that Jehovah can and feels. Even then, it is just as agreeable that some may not be able to, because they cannot feel that emotion towards someone who has done such things and are scared for life. That is an injury in itself, surely. There are so many strings to this bow that it is not possible to be all things to all people and to reach all degrees of hurt in a conciliatory manner. But having said that, I felt that it was worth pointing out that what is expected of us in terms of extending ourselves as far as we are able in pursuit of Jehovah’s will, or what we should strive for, is the understanding of mercy and forgiveness in imitation of Jehovah’s value on such, as it does not seem to be a perfunctory thing the way that the watchtower has dealt with this matter and in not compensating the victims with justice and understanding, let alone money that can do nothing to alleviate the pain. I am so dreadfully sorry that you have suffered this trial.

        • Song of Hannah

          Aw thanks Burt. You are a very kind & loving man & brother and I so appreciate your posts! Also, I understand the other view – how some can’t move on unless they forgive the unrepentant wrongdoer. But me, I draw comfort from not forgiving, and it allows me to move on and forget about it as a thing of the past – in fact, I used to anguish about the whole matter until I made my decision, and since deciding not to forgive, I don’t hardly even think about the matter any more. It helped me put closure on it, and draw comfort from knowing that Jehovah will make sure justice takes place. And if in the future I see that Jehovah and Jesus has chosen to forgiven him for some reason, then I will be happy to forgive him too. Because I certainly trust their judgement more than my own…

          • Song of Hannah

            I also want to mention, I absolutely agree it is self righteous not to forgive the personal offenses and weaknesses of others. And not forgiving such slights is wicked itself. But when it comes to gross willful sins against others or God – to withhold forgiveness is making a stand for what is right. Otherwise, all those who have executed judgement upon the wicked such as David, Jehu, Phinehas (Num 25:8) Jael, Elisha (2 Kings 2:23), and even Esther would be considered “self-righteous”. Also every Elder that ever disfellowshipped a gross wrongdoer would likewise be pegged.

            For clarity I’d like to quote the Insight book on Forgiveness:

            ” Moreover, forgiving others for personal offenses, regardless of the number of times involved, is a Christian requirement. (Lu 17:3, 4; Eph 4:32; Col 3:13) God’s forgiveness is not extended toward those who refuse to forgive others. (Mt 6:14, 15) However, even when serious wrongdoing leads to expulsion of “the wicked man” from the Christian congregation, that person may in due time be accorded forgiveness if he proves that he is truly repentant. At that time all in the congregation can confirm their love for him. (1Co 5:13; 2Co 2:6-11) However, Christians are not required to forgive those who practice malicious, willful sin with no repentance. Such become God’s enemies.​—Heb 10:26-31;

            Ps 139:21, 22 “Do I not hate those who hate you, O Jehovah, And loathe those who revolt against you? 22 I have nothing but hatred for them; They have become real enemies to me.” ”

            Also these scriptures further help show God’s view on the matter:

            2Ch 19:2 Jeʹhu the son of Ha·naʹni the visionary now went out before him and said to King Je·hoshʹa·phat: “Is it to the wicked that help is to be given, and is it for those hating Jehovah that you should have love? And for this there is indignation against you from the person of Jehovah.”

            Ps 119:158 I have seen those who are treacherous in dealing, And I do feel a loathing, because they have not kept your own saying.

            Ps 101:3 3 I shall not set in front of my eyes any good-for-nothing thing. The doing of those who fall away I have hated; It does not cling to me.

            Jer 20:12 12. But you, O Jehovah of armies, are examining the righteous one; you are seeing the kidneys and the heart. May I see your vengeance upon them, for to you I have revealed my case at law.

            • Volcanic

              more big hugs, Hannah. Beautifully put.

    • ewatchman

      Burt., the issue here is not even about the pedophile. Sure, he can be forgiven. The real issue is that the WT knowing allows convicted pedophiles to go out in their communities knocking on doors. It is reckless and irresponsible and borderline criminal.

      • Kevin b

        If he’s a registered sex offender you have to be a certain distance from a school or a park. I guess you can go to a store where kids are. But to go in service where a child may be home alone ain’t the smartest thing to do. We all know Watchtower loves to make rules, but the ones they should have in place they don’t. Blind guides!!

        • Joel

          Blind guides indeed! And the few that have a little “sight” left, their view is growing dimmer all the time!

      • Burt Reynolds

        Yes I agree. I was thinking in terms more of what is being said and to whom in the above article and the common thinking in many of the ex. JW sites. I agree that the watchtower is criminally in contempt of the possible consequences to victims and certainly of the sensitivities of the population in general, but though that is the case in this article, there is also the individual in it, as the focus for the debate, being used as an example. Well, that’s fine too, but I felt it worth the mention that as an individual, we should still endeavour to apply the principles in a greater depth as possible. This sin against the person and the soul of a child is heinous beyond imagining and results in a lifetime affliction. It never goes away, neither from the victim or the family, and it is the populist ideal and in law and on the YouTube ex JW sites to condemn for life. That may be the right thing to do in this system, yet we feel enlightened as to the next system and in doing so, perhaps should think that these individuals may have been poisoned by our system along with so many others. It’s a can of worms and maybe I should not have opened it, but I felt it was an aspect that should be explored in biblical reasoning, and if I have offended anyone then of course I’m sorry.

        • Song of Hannah

          You certainly didn’t offend me – I appreciated your thoughtfulness! ?

        • irene evans

          i agree with Robert , the policies of the WT are what allows the pedophiles to remain , and i think they have let the brother down who at least admits his sin, we will all be targets by outraged people because of the cowardly actions of the WT, but i also agree with Burt , i am a victim of abuse , i am 69 yrs old …..my abuse or rather the effects have never left me , and will only do so in the new system. no child should have to suffer for so long. all victims ask is to be believed,….but the WT put this silly two witness rule in place..in fact the Muslim religion devalues their women as they two have to have two witnesess to rape or abuse

          • Basavaraj Of North Karnataka

            Yeah that’s right!!

        • Basavaraj Of North Karnataka

          You and Robert are right I agree with you

        • T L C

          I am moved by the depth of your understanding and compassion to even be able to present this point of view despite what your family has been through. I don’t know how I would EVER be able to handle something like that happening to my daughter so my heart goes out to you!!! But anyways…I definitely understand and agree with the point of view that you are taking on this. That is why Jehovah is the ultimate judge–only He knows the hearts. We never know what prompts people to carry out these heinous crimes–they might have been abused themselves. Not to say that this makes it right by any means but just saying I understand your point…

      • Basavaraj Of North Karnataka

        I agree with your point that you brought forth. That’s really true

      • Patrick Langat

        #ewatchman so former convicted pedophiles or insolent people (1 Co 6:11, 1Ti 1:13) should not follow Jesus’ counsel to preach or go door to door even if they’ve quit their former behaviour (1Pe 1:14)? If someone’s past should follow one even after mending bad ways then what does forgiveness (Ps 103:12) of sin mean then?

        • ewatchman

          Going door-to-door is not the only way there is to preach. Standing in a public place with an information cart would be better than for a known pedophile to knock on the door of someone’s private home, where children often answer the door.

          • sally

            There should be a risk assessment in place. A risk assessment should conclude that anyone with a past offence for child molestation is some sort of risk, all be it a low one. On that basis in no way should door to door knocking where children could reside take place. As you said there are other methods of preaching, it is not the only one. I am speaking as a Social Worker in Child Protection here. I have seen the damage, seen the long term effects that this crime causes and anyone who has perpetrated this crime against children, however long ago and however sorry they are, should accept that accepting the risk factor has nothing to do with forgiveness.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Surely the Watchtower’s policies are clearly at fault and no doubt the perpetrator’s of these heinous crimes against children are totally at fault but nonetheless there is one more guilty party and I am referring to the parents / parent who were overly trusting when It came to trusting their child’s welfare with so-called trusted members of any congregation, yes I’m afraid the parents are guilty.

              Now some of you here might get angry with me because of my opinion but the truth is the truth and the truth is you can’t really trust your children’s welfare with anybody unsupervised if you want to be 100% sure that no herm would / will come to them, In other words the parents are ultimately responsible for the safety and well being for their children and regardless of how much we trust someone whether It be in service or a social get together ,
              “do not let your children leave your eyesight”
              regardless of how much you trust someone.

              3 Do not put your trust in princes Nor in a son of man, who cannot bring salvation.

              Isaiah 2:22 For your own sakes, quit trusting in mere man, Who is only the breath in his nostrils. Why should he be taken into account?

              Jeremiah 17:5 This is what Jehovah says: Cursed is the man* who puts his trust in mere humans, Who relies on human power, And whose heart turns away from Jehovah.

            • nobody should be angry with that logic and sound reason. its the truth.

            • Joel

              Excellent reasoning Sally! Here Here!

            • sally

              Thank you Joel!

            • Burt Reynolds

              Oh yes, I remember risk assessments. A bit like the social work degree. Back in the seventies, as was the current joke then, the university degree….as it was then….was said to be stamped on each sheet of the university loo rolls….social work degree, please take one. I would spend days analysing risk, it would be read by my manager, then by the area manager, then by the Court, then filed, then forgotten about because there was ‘insufficient funds’. It was still the same issue when I retired. And so the risks remained. Oddly, that brother during the commission, the one with the starkly contrasting red face and white hair, voiced the general excuse of the social services, ‘ we cannot protect all the children…’ It’s true, but there would be a lot less abuse if the money spent on nuclear weapons, political kickbacks and bribes, olympics, wars in general etc etc ad nauseam, ad infinitum. Like the politicians, the will of the governing body just is not there. You are absolutely right……..Take the rest of the day off…I used to say to my team, and handed them ANOTHER case. I was known for my sarcasm…..

            • sally

              Lol yes Burt, it is for all those reasons I got out a year ago of Statutory Services. As I realized I was not going to change the world and it’s many woes. Fortunately I found someone who could do just that 🙂

            • Burt Reynolds

              Very true. Are you working as a s/w independently now?

            • sally

              No I was independent in statutory services for a while, but now have changed direction – still working with people, just in a different way.

          • Joel

            Excellent point Brother King. Forgiveness is not the issue—that is a given, a guarantee from Jesus Christ. What is the issue is having WISDOM!

            Jehonadab’s comment is correct; if a person is an alcoholic and wants to stop drinking, then they would not get a job at a liquior store! Duh!!!

            If a person is a recovering pedophile, then common sense and the “wise course” is to stay away from persons, places (door to door ministry), and things where CHILDREN are involved!

            If you want to carry out your God-given and God-instructed right to preach the good news of the kingdom, then by all means do so! But be wise . . . preach in a way and in a manner that DOES NOT INVOLVE OR EXPOSES ONE TO CHILDREN!!! Brother King’s suggestion is spot on correct!

            Do you get it Patrick?

            Being forgiven is not the problem. The issue is allowing God’s underserved kindness (or “grace”) to have FULL SWAY in the recovering sinners life. And the way you do that is by prayer. . . working in harmony with your prayers. . . and having WISDOM to stay away from the object of ones misguided and pervected desire—in this case . . . children.

        • Same as a person trying to quit drinking, and gets a job at a liquor store. Or a person who wants to quit gambling moves to Las Vegas. Not a good idea.

        • Joel

          Hi Patrick. This is Brother Joel. I tried to answer, give a little prospective, to your query about what ‘forgiveness of sins’ really means. The problem is that I posted it in the general population. So you will have to search my response. If this helps . . . I started it by saying “Excellent point Brother King” . . .

          • Patrick Langat

            Good morning (it’s morning here in Kenya), thanks #Joel, #ewatchman and #Jehonadab for your explanations, the equivalent example of a recovering alcoholic given has now made it clear to me why a former pedophile should not go door to door.

            • Joel

              You are more than welcome my brother! And please, if possible, join us more often with your posts; we look forward to hearing your thoughts, opinions, queries, and comments. We love you bro!

        • Burt Reynolds

          Hello Patrick, I think the issue has to do with the modern consensus of opinion, the risk of recidivism, and the sensibilities that people have. It is not that the offender cannot be forgiven, though some may not chose to, which is understandable, or that he or she would be forgiven by Jehovah should they repent. It was acknowledged on this site, that there are other means of witnessing, such as through the Internet, or by incidental means, such as when meeting with friends. Indeed, the repentant offender may chose to do this rather than put himself in a situation where opportunities may tempt him to sin again. Were he or she to go door to door, it is likely that what they are, or have been, would be the stumbling block, or mental block, or topic of conversation, rather than the bible. Forgiveness is still the priority for us, with repentant people, for us and as commanded by Jehovah, and this would stand for anyone who repents of whatever sin. It is an unfortunate fact, that the past does follow us all our lives, but that does not stop a full repentance being fully forgiven. It is those who do not value such, who can neither forgive or forget.

    • All children are vulnerable to cunning child predators. And the world has sunk to such a depraved state child sexual predators are proliferating.
      And the case can be made that the children of Jehovah’s Witnesses are especially vulnerable. That is because in a congregational setting children are in close association with a lot of men. And children and adults are even encouraged to mingle and “associate” with each other. And all are trained to respect the elders and ministerial servants, since they have been appointed by holy spirit.

      It is well known that child predators slyly groom their intended victims over a period of time in order to win the trust of both the parent(s) and the child. It seems that the congregations of Jehovah’s Witnesses are an ideal setting for pedophiles to operate.

      • Joel

        That’s right Joe.

        The local Congregations are furtile breeding grounds for pedophiles and child sexual abuse of all kinds.

        I wonder how much longer Jehovah Will tolerate such archaic and harmful policies. I pray He addresses the situation soon. It is harming way too many children . . . and the average local Witness is none-the-wiser.

    • ELiJAHxSEVEN

      My oldest son was abused…I found out years later…there is nothing other than faith in Jehovah that would have kept me from going off the deep end and exacting revenge…forgiveness is difficult for us, expecially in the case of our children…all I can say is, that I have no words of comfort other than to speak of my personal situation…if not for Jehovah and His forgiveness, I couldn’t endure…I have thrown myself to the ground and He has given me the strength to forgive the most wicked of deeds…Jehovah has assured me that He alone will execute judgement and exact judicial punishment…I pray the day He wipes every tear from the eyes of those who love and trust in Him…

      • irene evans

        yes Elijah my own pain is hard to endure bit when its your children its a different matter, to make matters worse i was an abused wife …but without Jehovah i would not be here now , he helped me to endure , the WT controls every aspect of our lives, wish i could have divorced much sooner , then less damage would have been done

        • ELiJAHxSEVEN

          I am sorry…my heart goes out and I pray for all…we can’t dwell on what we could have done, but, focus on what Jehovah will do!…Take Care!

  • Sharon

    sorry brother robert but i cant help myself! to NWOBS9014-ARE YOU KIDDING ME? my question to you is where would you go away too? the kingdom hall twice a week? assemblies?or were you thinking more along the lines of some idol worship at JW.ORG,the governing body has been lying to us sheeple for over 100yrs.I myself will stick with the truth about the truth.

    • Kevin b

      Well said!

  • 感觉很不错的样子!

  • Volcanic

    Romans 12:3,

    I dreamed that Armageddon was fought the other night, with the great Jehovah using all his might
    And when the battle ended and satan was abyssed, I was very thankful that I was one he’d missed.

    Then, just as God had promised, the ‘New World’ gate sprung wide and there appeared an angel to usher me inside.

    And at Jehovahs banquet which all survivors shared, were some I judged unworthy and others as unfair!
    Angry words came to my lips, but never were set free

    For every face showed such surprise………………No-one expected me!

    ** Brothers, a little poem just to remind us all that we are not the Judge xoxoxo

    • Joel

      I liked it a lot! We should have more “Kingdom poetry” on this site. Yes! Poems that inspire and dare us to dream of a better world! Keep ’em com’in!

  • id say build separate kingdom halls like there are trailer parks for registered sex offenders but that dont seem right. they need to be registered to begin with anyway

  • Joshua

    It would be a good idea for Jehovah’s witnesses to limit the preaching of people who were convicted of child abuse to letter writing, where they can still participate in the ministry and not offend the conscience of others. That being said people who have had something of this nature in their past and have repented of it shouldn’t be harassed by people (like the person who made this video) who have a grudge against Jehovah’s witnesses or who just dislike thwm and are persecuting them. They search out any way they can to slander those they dislike, and that’s what this really is. This man isn’t a repeat offender and it happened twenty years ago. What they are doing is persecuting Christ, when someone repents and truly repents that’s a testimonial to Christ and the holy spirit that repentance is possible for those who search for God and turn around. This guy is someone who isn’t so much interested in the victim so much as he is interested in opposing Jehovah’s witnesses and the ministry because of the resentment he harbors against them.

    • Bklyn Kevin

      Hello and welcome Joshua. Food for thought .
      Regardless of whether this convicted sex offender Is being persecuted on purpose or not or whether he Is a repeated offender or not, how do you / parents know for sure he has completely repented of his wicked ways? And would not commit sexual abuse again against a child?, thus destroying another child’s life, the truth is one cannot know for sure and a responsible parent would not put their child in harm’s way.
      I mean are you willing to take the chance with your child or anybody’s child because he supposedly repented?.

      • Joshua

        Hi, thank you, I as I mentioned would recommend to the watchtower or any Christian organization that giving them a writing assignment as their ministry would be a better choice so as not to stumble others, but usually a person’s repentance is determined by the works that show repentance, if this individual hasn’t had any other offenses and over such a long history is would show he has repented. If people are unsatisfied with the watchtowers approach on how they handle these cases of child abuse then there are the secular authorities that are in place as God’s administrators, and by the secular authorities position this man has paid his debt and received his discipline, we never want to develop the world’s attitude regarding people who once lived an ungodly lifestyle and repeatedly punish someone who has repented and paid his debt. You know I’m sure as Paul said that that’s what some in the Corinthian congregation were. 1 Corinthians 6:11,
        Forgiv is a vital aspect of true worship and being transformed into the image of Christ. Matthew 18:21, 22 Peter asked Christ how many times he was supposed to forgive his brother up to seven? And Christ answered no, up to seventy seven, and again there’s Paul words in 1 Corinthians that tell us that love does not keep account of the injury, you haven’t truly forgiven someone if you continue to remind them of a sin that they have been punished for and repented from, that this man hasn’t any other offenses that I heard of should demonstrate repentance, but ad I said because of the severity of the offense and to not offend the conscience of others they should be given a writing and mailing ministry and be be sure the individual is never alone with a child where an opportunity can be given to Satan to incite the person to sin again.

        • Joshua

          What I mean is we always want to be careful. We never want our love to wax cold, if you think about a candle when it’s lit the wax is soft from the Heat, and are Christian love is like that we don’t want it to wax cold when the wax grows cold it hardens and it’s not good for anything it’s the same condition with our heart.

          • Joel

            All very good and heartfelt points Joshua.

            . . . but keep that guy away from kids, please!!!

            • Joshua

              Yes we want to be careful but after someone has repented we should be careful not to continue to look at a person in a particular light that demonstrates we haven’t forgiven a person at all, for example if we “mark” an individual where it isn’t warranted and do not truly forgive a person then God isn’t going to forgive our sins and I am first partaker when I say that, that includes everyone. we don’t know what the circumstances were in everything, but God does. There are different elements that are considered, one it’s the congregations responsibility that people with this kind of offense should never be allowed to work without being accompanied by one or two elders, also a parent also has responsibility to look after there children, and who makes the polices also has a responsibility that things are handles decently and in order. These things aren’t really opinions they are the word of God, if you meditate and examine the words of Christ and the apostles. If you “mark” an individual after they have repented then your heart isn’t pure, you have to freely forgive a person, and a reasonable amount of time should have shown whether a person has repented or not. It’s not any one of these things but all of these things that should be able to cause God’s spirit to work and produce fruit in the congregation.

            • Joel

              Excellent admonition my brother.

              But at the same time, the course of godly wisdom would impel us to . . .

              . . . keep that guy away from kids, please!!!

              Love ya still.

            • Joshua

              Thank you, my opinion with regard to that would be that a better way to say it would be too prevent situations and circumstances that would allow him or an individual like this to be alone with children, because if you just say keep this guy away from kids you still marking that individual after he’s repented, if he has truly repented then he should be treated like the other members of the congregation and to be able to talk and interact with other people, and I say that having a child myself. If this particular individual wiring a congregation that I attended I would allow him to talk to my son and say hello and to treat him like any other member of the congregation because if you truly forgiven that person then you don’t Harbor resentment or Mark that individual. However I wouldn’t allow that individual to be alone with my son and when want any other members of the congregation to allow their children to be alone but we should still treat them like a human being and somebody that has repented and God had forgiven, because if we don’t God will not forgive our sin, God will treat us exactly how we treated that individual

            • Joel

              In truth, Joshua, you are right.

              What you have just posted, in all fairness, is absolutely correct.

              Thank you for bringing out such good points. Well done!

              Joel.

            • Joshua

              Thanks, I only say that to really look at Scripture in truth and to divide the word of God in evenly and in truth we have to look at it fairly, and I have my fair share of sins I need forgiveness for, and the same forgiveness I desire and hope for in God has to be given to others from me in true forgiveness. The same forgiveness I desire I have to give to others.

            • Joel

              Words to live by! Good back and forth spiritual food!

            • Joshua

              Thanks, the world Keeps a record of all of the sins and mistakes that a person makes but there is true forgiveness with Yah, I really like the Psalmist words in Psalms 32
              Blessed is he whose transgressions are forgiven, whose sins are covered.
              2
              Blessed is the man whose sin the LORD does not count against him and in whose spirit is no deceit.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Joshua your Claiming you would put the child’s welfare first yet in another comment of yours you said” you would allow him to talk to your son and say hello and to treat him like any other member of the congregation.

              now like I said in another comment how could you as a “responsible” parent be 100% sure that this sex offender has completely repented? And that you’re not putting your child in harm’s way?

              And that he would not commit sexual abuse again against another child?, Or perhaps your own child – thus destroying another child’s life, the truth is one cannot know for sure and a “responsible” parent would not put their child in harm’s way.

              The child’s welfare comes first “not the pedophile” who has become marked due to his own heinous crime against children.

              Excerpted from Joshua comments

              Joshua said” I’m sorry if you’re upset or take offense. There’s nothing in my comments that suggested that I don’t put a child’s welfare first there’s nothing in my comments that said a child’s welfare shouldn’t be put first. A person that has committed a sin of that nature shouldn’t be left alone with children which I said in the previous comments

              Joshua said” if he has truly repented then he should be treated like the other members of the congregation and to be able to talk and interact with other people, and I say that having a child myself.

            • Joshua

              I’m sorry if your misunderstanding something, what I mean is if you know how people socialize with others after the meeting and talk to one another about how they’ve been or what has been going on in their life and things like that? I wouldn’t prohibit my child from taking to the brother or sister, we should reaffirm out love for such an individual if that person had repented. If I were to continue to keep an account of the injury or refuse to forgive the person then I would be forgiving them from the heart. When we forgive them we let go, and no longer remember the debt, that’s what true forgiveness is, not only would I be there in the presence of my son so would the whole congregation, I would not allow them to be alone with the person and would keep my children and the congregations children safe by keeping that person from being with a child alone.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              On the contrary I don’t think I am misunderstanding you however like I said earlier in one of my comments your perception is different from what I perceive.

              If you truly love you brothers you will not bring him into temptation.

              If you continue to dangle the alcoholic beverage in front of the alcoholics face then it’s more than likely that he will be tempted beyond his control.

              Matthew 6:13
              And do not bring us into temptation, but deliver us from the wicked one.

              Matthew 26:41
              Keep on the watch and pray continually, so that you may not enter into temptation. The spirit, of course, is eager, but the “flesh is weak”.

              James 1:15
              Then the desire, when it has become fertile, gives birth to sin; in turn sin, when it has been carried out, brings forth death.

            • Joshua

              I don’t like labeling people and I don’t think I would label a brother or sister a child abuse addict that has an addiction like an alcoholic, and I don’t think allowing my kids to say hi to someone at the kingdom Hall is anything remotely close to what your trying to say it is, if that’s true we shouldn’t let out kids come outside at all, because it’s too much of a temptation for the child abuse alcoholic and that wouldn’t be loving, sorry that’s a really bad comparison in my opinion, but I hope that helps you

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Joshua You know I’d tried to create some neutral ground so that we could continue our conversation but I can see that’s just not gonna work, so at this Point I’m going to personally block you cause I had enough of your nonsense.

            • Joshua

              Yes I see it differently, if he is in that great a temptation he shouldn’t be at the meeting,or perhaps we shouldn’t bri g our children at all to the meetings or let them leave our houses because the temptation is too great,i think that comparison is a really bad one an kind of a vain attempt to try to validate a view that isn’t similar at all to the topic. I think it’s a really bad comparison. Children aren’t carrots and people who have committed abuse aren’t alcoholics. We follow God’s word in Scripture and it says to lovingly reaffirm your love for your brother, treat him like a human being and encourage and pray for him. Parents can allow their family members and children to say hello to the brother or sister and tell them the family is praying for him. I think it’s a really unloving approach really, but I hope this word can edify you, encourage you and make you a lover of his truth.

            • Song of Hannah

              Amen brother Kevin!

              I’ve come to conclude, that when it comes to forgiveness, Jehovah views sex crimes differently from other crimes.

              Reason being, if a person is guilty of adultery, the innocent spouse had the full choice wether to forgive the sex crime against them or not. Even if the guilty spouse showed all the repentance in the world, they can divorce them and marry another, and Jehovah will not hold them guilty of adultery. However, if they willingly have sexual relations with the guilty spouse afterwards, that is evidence of forgiveness, and any divorce and remarriage would again be held up as adultery.

              So interestedly, even if a person guilty of adultery was repentant then or even years later, if divorced (unforgiven), they can not lay claim to their spouse again. So the guilty spouse has perpetual repercussions because of their sex crime. Can they protest and say “I have never truly been forgiven!” Of course not. That’s the repercussions they have to live with, because of the sex crime they committed.

              So to, a molester will have repercussions because of his sex crimes. It doesn’t mean he can’t be forgiven by God. But no matter how repentant, he will always live with the a perpetual dishonor because of the damage he did, that cannot be reversed. Just like adultery.

              These scriptures lead me to this conclusion:

              Proverbs 6:32 Anyone committing adultery with a woman is lacking good sense; The one who does so brings ruin on himself. 33 He will get only wounds and dishonor, And his disgrace will not be wiped away.

              Jer 3:8 When I saw that, I sent unfaithful Israel away with a full certificate of divorce because of her adultery. But her treacherous sister Judah did not become afraid; she too went out and committed prostitution.

              Matt 5:31 Moreover, it was said: ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ 32 However, I say to you that everyone divorcing his wife, except on account of sexual immorality, makes her a subject for adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

            • Song of Hannah

              Also, a lot of folks don’t think child molestation is mentioned in the Bible – but I think this is what is meant by “defrauding the fatherless child”. Because a child owns nothing, indeed what else can they possibly be defrauded of, except for their virginity?

              Is 1:17 Learn to do good, seek justice, Correct the oppressor, Defend the rights of the fatherless child, And plead the cause of the widow.”

              Duet 27:19 “‘Cursed is the one who perverts the judgment of a foreign resident, a fatherless child, or a widow.’ (And all the people will say, ‘Amen!’)

              Ezekiel 22:7 Within you they treat their father and mother with contempt. They defraud the foreign resident, and they mistreat the fatherless child and the widow.”’”

              Mail 3:5 “I will come near to you for judgment, and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, against the adulterers, against those who take false oaths, against those who defraud the hired worker, the widow, and the fatherless child, and against those who refuse to help the foreigner. These have not feared me,” says Jehovah of armies.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Double “POW”……

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Hannah I greatly appreciated your unique perspective on this issue as it helped me greatly to resolve some other Inquiries I had.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              I kinda feel guilty because I block Joshua but the truth of the matter is he was sucking the spiritual life right out of me with his trolling nonsense.
              So perhaps you should leave your comments with him as I think it might help him, If he is really interested!. Love you my sister and again thank you for your perspective as I said earlier it really helped me.

            • Song of Hannah

              I totally understand dear brother, will do!

            • Song of Hannah

              Geesh I see what you mean now! lol ?

            • Joshua

              I think what your failing to see is the spiritual life Kevin is talking about being sucked out of him isn’t it at all, it the fact that he doesn’t want to look at himself and do an honest examination of our spiritual heart, he’s causing division over something I never said, and he doesn’t want to hear it because it forces him to look at himself and do an honest examination of the heart in escaping one net he has fell into another, and he is judging me over a personal choice that I would allow my children to say hello to someone who has repented. A tree is recognized by it’s fruit and that is not Spiritual fruit that yields a crop. I do forgive him and I will pray for him and everyone else here, I would hop you would do the same for me, but when he blocks someone without cause or causes division without cause then him and everyone else who does the same has fallen into darkness he does not know where he is going because the darkness has blinded him, he who says he loves God and hates his brother does not know God,

              Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
              He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
              (1john 2:3-9)
              My Christ bless each and every one of you

            • Song of Hannah

              I’ve known Kevin quite a while on this board, and one thing I can attest to is his humility and willingness to consider and take up new thoughts that previously differed from his own. It’s the intent behind your words, that are harmful. You don’t word things so as to “win your brother”. You adroitly mask within them concealed ridicule, and in such a masterful way that you can cry foul when others are hurt by them. It’s a very old, passive-aggressive technique that’s quite effective in raising one’s self-esteem while destroying the other’s.

              I hope that you will take up your own advice, and reflect inwardly on yourself, and ask “What did I do to hurt my brother, so that he now doesn’t want anything to do with me? How do my actions play a role in this?” If love of your brother is your true motive, surely you will reflect seriously on your own behavior and the resulting affect it is having upon others.

            • Joshua

              Your trying to read my heart and the intention of my words, and in posting written words they can lose something in what’s being said. I’ve known Kevin for quite a long time also and have been on this site as long as you, probably longer than you and this isn’t the first instance he has behaved like this, or with me he’s done this with other people too, there was nothing adroitly, cleverly disguised or passively aggressively meant, there was no concealed ridicule I meant what I said and say what I mean, it wasn’t mock humility, it was true humility, I do hope he’s edified, and encouraged I pray that for myself every day. I would ask that you be first to take your own council, and Kevin, like I said there was nothing in my comments that suggested at all that I said to trust children with child abusers and nothing I said that suggested trusting our children with them, yet still he propped up an argument based on that false accusation and what he was suggesting, he was looking for conflict and division, I hope you’ll be playful over your own heart and his, our actions and words reflect the intent and his intent wasn’t genuine he was searching out division, he was looking to take some opposing stance, to either draw attention to himself, to raise his own self esteem or because that an imperfection he has.my self esteem is fine, I didn’t come to the person and begin questioning his intentions and motives so I hope you’ll ask yourself the same questions and him too, I hope you’ll grow to Christian maturity as Paul said;

              And a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be gentle to all, able to teach, patient, 2 Timothy 2:24

              If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which accords with godliness, 4 he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and arguments over words, from which come envy, strife, reviling, evil suspicions, 5 useless wranglings[a] of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself.
              1 Timothy 3-5
              I hope you’ll receive this encouragement and won’t be offended, I pray always for God to have the right heart condition and I’ll pray that for you brothers and sisters also. I hope you’ll overcome the evil suspicions you perceive in others and Kevin too, Yah bless you

            • Joshua

              Some of the people who are on the guilty side of side of what is being shared or what is being spoken of part of their reason, or part of the reason why they are is because they are double minded or because they are single minded, not in righteousness but in unrighteousness, because their heart is single minded and set towards hatred, towards envy, towards manipulating, towards controlling, toward obsessive behavior, toward spiritually psychotic behavior, envy, jealousy, and just hatred for anything and anyone they can’t control. So they become obsessed with people who resist their manipulating ways. Not mincing words this is something the Lord wants his people to be free from and on guard against in our spiritual hearts and minds. To those who are guilty of this or have issues regarding some of these tendencies you have one or two choices, you can receive this word as from the Lord, you can really truly examine your lives, but I know you know where you stand, for those who have these tendencies or create argument’s over words , for those who are guilty who cause unnecessary student envy division you know where you stand, but you can choose to receive it as from the Lord, or you can write it off as from me, you can continue to accuse, you can continue to point fingers, you can continue to look for fault and find fault, and then just try to justify your actions, or you can receive it as from the Lord and allow his holy spirit to correct you, and direct you in the right way. I have zero resentment for Kevin or you, I thank God for your lives and cherish each and every one of you, and these tendencies we have in the imperfect flesh I also have to pray about and ask the Lord to condition my heart to allow it to receive council and apply it and mold me into the kind of vessel he wants and desires me to be, a vessel of honor and not of dishonor. To allow his holy spirit to grow and produce fruit that yields a crop and to grow in love, long suffering kindness, gentleness, and peace.F or those who are on the right side of this road you can allow it to be a warning not to get on the wrong side of Jah and on the wrong side of the spirit and nature of Christ, you can allow it to encourage you to continue in the right way to continue to walk in righteousness and develop in the fruit of God’s holy spirit and allow it to examine our hearts and motives and how are words night affect others. Jah Bless you all.

            • Joshua

              Some of the people who are on the guilty side of side of what is being shared or what is being spoken of part of their reason, or part of the reason why they are is because they are double minded or because they are single minded, not in righteousness but in unrighteousness, because their heart is single minded and set towards hatred, towards envy, towards manipulating, towards controlling, toward obsessive behavior, toward spiritually psychotic behavior, envy, jealousy, and just hatred for anything and anyone they can’t control. So they become obsessed with people who resist their. Not mincing words this is something the Lord wants his people to be free from and on guard against in our spiritual hearts and minds. To those who are guilty of this or have issues regarding some of these tendencies there are one or two choices, you can receive this word as from the Lord, you can really truly examine your lives, but I know you know where you stand, for those who have these tendencies or create argument’s over words , for those who are guilty who cause unnecessary student envy division you know where you stand, but you can choose to receive it as from the Lord, or you can write it off as from me, you can continue to accuse, you can continue to point fingers, you can continue to look for fault and find fault, and then just try to justify your actions, or you can receive it as from the Lord and allow his holy spirit to correct you, and direct you in the right way. I have zero resentment for Kevin or you, I thank God for your lives and cherish each and every one of you, and these tendencies we have in the imperfect flesh I also have to pray about and ask the Lord to condition my heart to allow it to receive council and apply it and mold me into the kind of vessel he wants and desires me to be, a vessel of honor and not of dishonor. To allow his holy spirit to grow and produce fruit that yields a crop and to grow in love, long suffering kindness, gentleness, and peace.For those who are on the right side of this road you can allow it to be a warning not to get on the wrong side of Jah and on the wrong side of the spirit and nature of Christ, you can allow it to encourage you to continue in the right way to continue to walk in righteousness and develop in the fruit of God’s holy spirit and allow it to examine our hearts and motives and how are words might affect others. Jah Bless you all. I thank God for peace, I make it a practice to walk and live a life of peace, and I drive to live in peace with all men and women, it’s motivated by sincere love and obedience to the holy spirit, but unless some of you get rid of the hatred and envy That’s motivating you to lash out at others both on and off line and develop obsessive behavior, some of you are obsessed with finding fault with others and looking for fault.and for some their envy and hatred and fault finding behavior is the going to hurt or stumble others.Its a spirit of obsession you have become fixated and obsessed with finding something wrong and finding fault with others when people make comments to others it does at times I can tell the spirit behind them is to find fault with others, when they share the word of God or make a comment in the comments section you listen or read their comments with the intent of finding something wrong with what they said do you know that fault finding is what the Pharisees and all those who came up against Christ did the Scriptures repeatedly tell us they looked with the intent of find fault with Christ and they became vessels of dishonor and some of you are guilty of that and have become the accuser brothers, I thank God I live in peace and am not like that and hope none of you will be and for those who do this it could cause some to lose in the race for life. By grace thank you

            • Bklyn Kevin

              One of the reasons I blocked Joshua.
              he is deceitful.
              “guilty of or involving deceit; deceiving or misleading others.

              So how has Joshua been deceitful one may ask?.

              You know when Joshua first arrived here I warmly welcomed him thinking it was his first or second time to visit Roberts site, And that’s what his Disqus profile had indicated as well. He Joined Jun 29, 2016.

              however Joshua never once indicated that he had knew me or spoken to me or you before yet please take note of what he said in one of his comments as of today.

              Joshua Song of Hannah 11 hours ago.
              Joshua said” I’ve known Kevin for quite a long time also and have been on this site as long as you, probably longer than you and this isn’t the first instance he has behaved like this, or with me. End Quote.

              Now the truth of the matter is I don’t know Joshua yet somehow he knows me as well as Hannah for a very long time as he said, how is this possible?.

              Will the answer is obvious, the only reason I don’t know Joshua is because Joshua change his name various times as well as deleted many of our old conversations I probably had with him as to deceive / mislead me on his Disqus profile.

              he has been stealthily stalking us waiting for the right moment to take his ill will revenge probably due to my retorting his nonsense in the past.

              So contrary to what Joshua has said about me, Joshua has been the one trying to plant seeds of doubt along with contentions as well as divisions.

              Joshua goal is to divide and conquer like his Father Satan the devil and he has been twisting the scriptures to do so.

              2 Peter 16-18.
              However, some things in them are hard to understand, and these things the ignorant /[ Joshua] and unstable are twisting, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
              You, therefore, beloved ones, having this advance knowledge, be on your guard so that you may not be led astray with them by the error of the lawless people and fall from your own steadfastness.
              No, but go on growing in the undeserved kindness and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

            • I thought I smelled a RAT.
              BLOCKED
              Thanks BK

            • Bklyn Kevin

              You know the old saying – When the cat’s away the mice will play…..

            • Bklyn Kevin

              I mean surely we don’t want rats to run rampant…..

            • Daisy

              Calling peter zuccerberg…peter zuccerberg, come in please…

            • Joshua

              If anyone wants to know it was my choice to remain anonymous for good reasons, but I’ll tell you the truth if to show you the evil condition of your hearts, I used a pseudonym for a good reason, my Name is Heath and Roberts had even postwd one of my articles on his website awhile ago and I had written a few articles of my own including Ezekiel’s valley, four horns and four craftsman and the man among the Myrtle trees, God tent over mankind, and I did support Roberts work, however a short time ago my life was threatened because of the some of the things I’ve written in those articles, so I’ve been working on my spiritual life and hadn’t commented in awhile though I’d read Roberts articles..so I used a pseudonym because the threats were getting worsethey were getting really worse, I’m not going to go into details about, so Kevin the other brothers and whoever, despite that I told Kevin, Hannah I loved them and hope they ensure he continued to show hatred and malice and has shown the spirit of Christ is not in him, I forgive him however and anything anyone does out of ignore..t just because a person has a hatred without cause we don’t have to delay forgiveness and be allow Christ to use mold us into his image, as for everyone else Daisy Joel thank you for inviting my comments love ya.

            • Daisy

              Love you too Heath…been thinking & worrying about you for a long time… Jehovah be with you too my brother. Love from Daisy formerly called Patri from google+.
              So you have known BK for a long time!

            • Joshua

              Yes, and I don’t hate him, I hope the best for all those who want to follow Christ and be like Christ. Before Stephen died he asked Christ to forgive those who were stoning him because they know not what they do. I haven’t posted any articles, my life has been threatened a few times, and it was getting worse and while some may say do it anyway, I know it’s something I have to work on and I hope in God he’ll allow me to do that. Thank God for you may he give you his peace and love and rich faith. God bless you so much.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Heath / Joshua you’re the one whos displaying the qualities of a evil heart with your many unwarranted insinuations concerning me and others as well.
              And for no real reason / Scriptural reason,.
              Now what I don’t understand is if you had a problem with me or If I done something to you why didn’t you in the past lay it bare with me as the bible suggest? Like a spiritually mature adult instead of twisting the scriptures around and acting like Satan’s spawn, sorry BUT you brought that on yourself the way you acted

              with your unwanted insinuations against me and others I mean some of the things you were saying was out right slander in my opinion.

              Now when you get over your temper tantrum please feel free to give me a message on face book in my private messenger and perhaps we can sort things out.

              P.S. Now surely if I had written something wrong on Roberts web site or did something wrong to somebody with all certainty I’m sure Robert would’ve informed me, However to date Robert has not corrected me in such a manner.

              Reply to Bklyn Kevin 9:20 p.m., Thursday Sept.1
              If anyone wants to know it was my choice to remain anonymous for good reasons, but I’ll tell you the truth if to show you the evil condition of your hearts, I used a pseudonym for a good reason, my Name is Heath and Roberts had even postwd one of my articles on his website awhile ago and I had written a few articles of my own including Ezekiel’s valley, four horns and four craftsman and the man among the Myrtle trees, God tent over mankind, and I did support Roberts work, however a short time ago my life was threatened because of the some of the things I’ve written in those articles, so I’ve been working on my spiritual life and hadn’t commented in awhile though I’d read Roberts articles..so I used a pseudonym because the threats were getting worsethey were getting really wors e, I’m not going to go into details about, so Kevin the other brothers and whoever, despite that I told Kevin, Hannah I loved them and hope they ensure he continued to show hatred and malice and has shown the spirit of Christ is not in him, I forgive him however and anything anyone does out of ignore..t just because a person has a hatred without cause we don’t have to delay forgiveness and be allow Christ to use mold us into his image, as for everyone else Daisy Joel thank you for inviting my comments love ya.

            • Joshua

              It’s you have insinuated everything starting with the insinuation I condone allowing children to associate with child abusers, then the malicious name calling, and the twisting of words to hide your own error, I haven’t insinuated anything your own behavior makes it self evident who’s spirit your under the influence of, Ill pray for you, God forgive you and I hope you will come to know the true nature and spirit of Christ and of love for brothers. Robert can choose what he want s to do however your words and your actions are self evident.

            • Joshua

              It’s you have insinuated everything you came and left a comment to my response and looked for reason to find fault starting with the insinuation I condone allowing children to associate with child abusers, then the malicious name calling, and the twisting of words to hide your own error, I haven’t insinuated anything your own behavior makes it self evident who’s spirit your under the influence of, Ill pray for you, God forgive you and I hope you will come to know the true nature and spirit of Christ and of love for brothers, by the fruit a tree is known and yours is self evident Robert can choose what he want to do however your words and your actions are self evident, you with malicious intent twist words, slander and name call and do not demonstrate you have the love of Christ in your heart. You didn’t even show concern my life was in danger a fellow brother in Christ, I hope you will allow the holy spirit to correct you and mature in the spirit of Christ, and show genuine love for the brethren and learn to continue as the scripture say to put up with one another in love, as far as far as it depends upon you be peaceable, I hope you will overcome the evil with good and come to know Christ. The greatest example other than giving his life for us while we were yet in sin was when he washed the feet of his disciples, the greatest man who ever lived and the God’s own image and reflection washed the feet of others.
              When he had finished washing their feet, he put on his clothes and returned to his place. “Do you understand what I have done for you?” he asked them. “You call me ‘Teacher’ and ‘Lord,’ and rightly so, for that is what I am. Now that I, your Lord and Teacher, have washed your feet, you also should wash one another’s feet. I have set you an example that you should do as I have done for you. Very truly I tell you, no servant is greater than his master, nor is a messenger greater than the one who sent him. Now that you know these things, you will be blessed if you do them..
              It’s a lesson in humility to care for others more than yourself, I’ve tried to readjust your thinking in a spirit of mildness and with love, what your doing is not loving and not patterned after Christ’s life, or his spirit. I forgive you because you don’t understand what your doing. I hope you will be a lover of his truth and battery our life, and words and actions after Christ. Would Christ approve of you calling someone names and twisting their words? The reason you do is because you don’t seem to want to look at examine your heart and what’s causes you to behave that way toward Christ’s brothers or sisters. I thank God for your life and I hope you will progress in producing fruit of the holy spirit. God Bless you. what you do to brothers or sisters you do to Christ, so I forgive you, I thank God for you and pray God will produce holy spirit that bears fruit. Christ is my witness I won’t dispute over worda anymore.
              Matthew 5:9;
              Blessed are the peacemakers for they will be called children of God.
              Romans 14:19;
              Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mural edification.
              James 3:18;
              Peacemakers who sow in peace reap a harvest of righteousness.
              Matthew 5:11
              Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
              Thank you God bless

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Joshua Bklyn Kevin • 4 hours ago

              Joshua / Heath said” It’s you who have insinuated everything comments against me, you came and left a response to my comment and looked for reason to find fault starting with the insinuation I condone allowing children to associate with child abusers, End quote.

              I didn’t have to insinuate nothing because you Joshua / Heath had already admitted you would condone or allow your child to associate with a child abuser .

              just read your own comment / quote below to verify that I am telling you the truth >.

              Excerpted from Joshua comments

              Joshua said” if he has truly repented then he should be treated like the other members of the congregation and to be able to talk and interact with other people, and I say that having a child myself. If this particular individual wiring a congregation that I attended
              I would allow him to talk to my son and say hello and to treat him like any other member of the congregation.
              without a doubt you are contradicting yourself Heath/Joshua..

              Excerpted from Joshua comments
              Joshua said” I’m sorry if you’re upset or take offense. There’s nothing in my comments that suggested that I don’t put a child’s welfare first there’s nothing in my comments that said a child’s welfare shouldn’t be put first.

              The child’s welfare comes first “not the pedophile” who has become marked due to his own heinous crime against children.

            • Joshua

              It’s you who have insinuated everything comments against me, you came and left a response to my comment and looked for reason to find fault starting with the insinuation I condone allowing children to associate with child abusers, then the malicious name calling, and the twisting of words to hide your own error, I haven’t insinuated anything your own behavior makes it self evident who’s spirit your under the influence of, Ill pray for you, God forgive you and I hope you will come to know the true nature and spirit of Christ and of love for brothers, by the fruit a tree is known and yours is self evident Robert can choose what he want to do however your words and your actions are self evident, you with malicious intent twist words, slander and name call and do not demonstrate you have the love of Christ in your heart. You didn’t even show concern my life was in danger a fellow brother in Christ, I hope you will allow the holy spirit to correct you and mature in the spirit of Christ, and show genuine love for the brethren and learn to continue as the scripture say to put up with one another in love, as far as far as it depends upon you be peaceable, I hope you will overcome the evil with good and come to know Christ. The greatest example other than giving his life for us while we were yet in sin was when he washed the feet of his disciples, the greatest man who ever lived and the God’s own image and reflection washed the feet of others.
              When he had finished washing their feet, he put on his clothes and returned to his place. “Do you understand what I have done for you?” he asked them. “You call me ‘Teacher’ and ‘Lord,’ and rightly so, for that is what I am. Now that I, your Lord and Teacher, have washed your feet, you also should wash one another’s feet. I have set you an example that you should do as I have done for you. Very truly I tell you, no servant is greater than his master, nor is a messenger greater than the one who sent him. Now that you know these things, you will be blessed if you do them..
              It’s a lesson in humility to care for others more than yourself, I’ve tried to readjust your thinking in a spirit of mildness and with love, what your doing is not loving and not patterned after Christ’s life, or his spirit. I forgive you because you don’t understand what your doing. I hope you will be a lover of his truth and battery our life, and words and actions after Christ. Would Christ approve of you calling someone names and twisting their words? The reason you do is because you don’t seem to want to look at examine your heart and what’s causes you to behave that way toward Christ’s brothers or sisters. I thank God for your life and I hope you will progress in producing fruit of the holy spirit. God Bless you. what you do to brothers or sisters you do to Christ, so I forgive you, I thank God for you and pray God will produce holy spirit that bears fruit. Christ is my witness I won’t dispute over worda anymore.
              Matthew 5:9;
              Blessed are the peacemakers for they will be called children of God.
              Romans 14:19;
              Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mural edification.
              James 3:18;
              Peacemakers who sow in peace reap a harvest of righteousness.
              Matthew 5:11
              Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.
              Thank you God bless

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Joshua Bklyn Kevin • 4 hours ago

              Joshua / Heath said” It’s you who have insinuated everything comments against me, you came and left a response to my comment and looked for reason to find fault starting with the insinuation I condone allowing children to associate with child abusers, End quote.

              I didn’t have to insinuate nothing because you Joshua / Heath had already admitted you would condone or allow your child to associate with a child abuser .

              just read your own comment / quote below to verify that I am telling you the truth >.

              Excerpted from Joshua comments

              Joshua said” if he has truly repented then he should be treated like the other members of the congregation and to be able to talk and interact with other people, and I say that having a child myself. If this particular individual wiring a congregation that I attended
              I would allow him to talk to my son and say hello and to treat him like any other member of the congregation.
              without a doubt you are contradicting yourself Heath/Joshua..

              Excerpted from Joshua comments
              Joshua said” I’m sorry if you’re upset or take offense. There’s nothing in my comments that suggested that I don’t put a child’s welfare first there’s nothing in my comments that said a child’s welfare shouldn’t be put first.

              The child’s welfare comes first “not the pedophile” who has become marked due to his own heinous crime against children.

            • Joshua

              Kevin, the same comment said I wouldn’t allow him to be alone with my child or with children if he is at the meeting and has repented and demonstrated repentance like this man for over twenty years then like I said i would allow him to talk to my child at the meeting in my presence and the presence of other brothers and sisters at the meeting, he’s been forgiven and your attitude shows by that you Haven’t forgiven because forgiveness is demonstrated though actions never said he should be trusted to be alone with any child, your not following the holy spirit or God’s word, because of your insistence on creating arguments over personal decisions and the lack of following Christ’s own words I don’t think you are a Christian I’m sorry God bless you though I hope you find Christ, because you don’t know Christ, may you come to love his truth and find repentance, that doesn’t mean I don’t love you, I thank God for your life and hope you come to an accurate knowledge of the truth. Any any Christian who is a true Christian would do the same regarding such a man, he may not have privileges or be trusted to be alone with a child but if he has repented that means he’s been forgiven and you as the Bible says are to reaffirm your love for him. I’d ask that you please don’t respond you don’t have a leg to stand on your not following Christ’s law or God’s word and I’m not responding to meaningless and baseless arguments. I would encourage you to do some reason forgiveness in the insight books and other sources and if you desire to follow after Christ not to engage or provoke arguments or personal decisions of other Christians and name calling and fault finding is a good subject for you to research, they are things that make a person a vessel of dishonor and are part of the spirit of Satan not Christ, so I hope if you love the truth you can bear fruit of the spirit of Christ, love, joy, peace, mildness,goodness, faith, long suffering, and self control. May God bless your search of his truth and the doing of it. I do forgive you, and love you, but you need to come to know the true gospel and spirit and nature of Christ okay? With love thank you.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              On the contrary it is you who needs the prayers Joshua / Heath.

              The point that I was making Heath is that you’re an out right liar according to your own comments which surely convict YOU of lying not to mention your deceptivemess with your cloak and dagger of deception with your various false names as to deceive people on this web site.

              Anybody who reads your dialog will see it for themselves that you’re a liar and a deceiver and anyone who is a liar and a deceiver is no brother of mine.

            • Song of Hannah

              Joshua – Kevin was not sure if you could see my reply, so he asked me to copy it directly to you. So here it is:

              Regarding all this, I want to reply to Joshua’s arguments on this too. Cause I’ve come to conclude, that when it comes to forgiveness, Jehovah views sex crimes differently from other crimes.

              Reason being, if a person is guilty of adultery, the innocent spouse had the full choice wether to forgive the sex crime against them or not. Even if the guilty spouse showed all the repentance in the world, they can divorce them and marry another, and Jehovah will not hold them guilty of adultery. However, if they willingly have sexual relations with the guilty spouse afterwards, that is evidence of forgiveness, and any divorce and remarriage would again be held up as adultery.

              So interestedly, even if a person guilty of adultery was repentant then or even years later, if divorced (unforgiven), they can not lay claim to their spouse again. So the guilty spouse has perpetual repercussions because of their sex crime. Can they protest and say “I have never truly been forgiven!” Of course not. That’s the repercussions they have to live with, because of the sex crime they committed.

              So to, a molester will have repercussions because of his sex crimes. It doesn’t mean he can’t be forgiven by God. But no matter how repentant, he will always live with the a perpetual dishonor because of the damage he did, that cannot be reversed. Just like adultery.

              These scriptures lead me to this conclusion:

              Proverbs 6:32 Anyone committing adultery with a woman is lacking good sense; The one who does so brings ruin on himself. 33 He will get only wounds and dishonor, And his disgrace will not be wiped away.

              Jer 3:8 When I saw that, I sent unfaithful Israel away with a full certificate of divorce because of her adultery. But her treacherous sister Judah did not become afraid; she too went out and committed prostitution.

              Matt 5:31 Moreover, it was said: ‘Whoever divorces his wife, let him give her a certificate of divorce.’ 32 However, I say to you that everyone divorcing his wife, except on account of sexual immorality, makes her a subject for adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

            • Song of Hannah

              Also, a lot of folks don’t think child molestation is mentioned in the Bible – but I think this is what is meant by “defrauding the fatherless child”. Because a child owns nothing, indeed what else can they possibly be defrauded of, except for their virginity?

              Is 1:17 Learn to do good, seek justice, Correct the oppressor, Defend the rights of the fatherless child, And plead the cause of the widow.”

              Duet 27:19 “‘Cursed is the one who perverts the judgment of a foreign resident, a fatherless child, or a widow.’ (And all the people will say, ‘Amen!’)

              Ezekiel 22:7 Within you they treat their father and mother with contempt. They defraud the foreign resident, and they mistreat the fatherless child and the widow.”’”

              Mail 3:5 “I will come near to you for judgment, and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, against the adulterers, against those who take false oaths, against those who defraud the hired worker, the widow, and the fatherless child, and against those who refuse to help the foreigner. These have not feared me,” says Jehovah of armies.

            • Joshua

              I would be careful on speculating what would be a private interpretation of what it means to defraud the fatherless, it could means something that we’re completely unaware and you could inadvertently be teaching what is false. Some things with regard to the Jewish customs and laws of God’s people are and which included tithes for the relief of the oppressed every three years and because of their lack of a father or husband and having no one, and the absence of a moral teacher and guidance. An interesting article stated;

              The fatherless are frequently mentioned in the Old Testament, generally in association with the widow and the stranger, as typical instances of the unprotected and necessitous, who are, specially subject to oppression, and also to God’s special protection. Great philanthropic regard is bestowed on this class throughout. In early legislation there is a special clause to guard them against affliction (Exodus 22:22-24). They have a still more prominent place in the Deuteronomic legislation, which gives instructions that a charitable fund be formed out of the tithe, once every three years, for the relief of the destitute (Deuteronomy 14:28, 29; Deuteronomy 26:12-14), and that gleanings be left in the cornfield, the olive garden, and the vineyard for the benefit of this class (Deuteronomy 24:19-22; compare Leviticus 19:9; 23:22, where, however, the “fatherless” are not specially mentioned). The Deuteronomist declares that God is on their side (Deuteronomy 10:18), and strongly condemns those who would oppress them (Deuteronomy 24:17; Deuteronomy 27:19). The prophets and psalmists are equally emphatic in pleading for mercy and justice to the fatherless, and in declaring that God is their special guardian (Isaiah 1:17 Jeremiah 7:6; Jeremiah 22:3 Hosea 14:3 Zechariah 7:10 Psalm 10:14; Psalm 68:5; Psalm 82:3; 146:09:00; compare Proverbs 23:10). Oppressing the fatherless is frequently mentioned as a typical act of cruelty and injustice (compare Job 6:27; Job 22:9; Job 24:3, 1; 29:12; 31:16, 17, 21; Psalm 94:6 Isaiah 1:23; Isaiah 10:2 Jeremiah 5:28 Ezekiel 22:7 Malachi 3:5). Here we have instances of the prophetic passion for righteousness and compassion for the helpless, inspired by a profound sense of the value of human life. Passages in the Apocrypha reflect the same spirit (2 Esdras 2:20; Ecclesiasticus 4:10).

              In the New Testament the word “fatherless” occurs but once, where James declares, in the spirit of the Old Testament prophets, that true religious ritual consists in visitation of the fatherless and widows and in moral purity (James 1:27). Here the word for “fatherless” is orphanos (“bereft,” “orphaned”), which is the Septuagint translation of the Old Testament yathom. In the New Testament the Greek word is found besides only in John 14:18, where it means destitute of a teacher or guide.

            • Joshua

              I understand what your saying, and how God may feel strongly about child abuse even more than other sins, even murder perhaps, but however he doesn’t feel differently about repentance, and while yes people who commit sin whatever the sin is have to live with that sin and the consequences of them, if a person commits adultery they have the consequences of losing their spouse and disfellowshipping, just as David had to live with his sin with Uriah’s wife, and until he did he lived with consequences from it, a person who commits fornication may contract HIV, so there are always consequences for sin that God does not shield us from, however that being said he does not view repentance differently, when a person truly repents he is forgiven by God his sins are as far off as the sunrise to the sunset. His debt has been cancelled as Christ illustrated in the parable and the Bible does not leave room for doubt how we are to treat repent wrongdoers, even of that nature, we forgive them the same as Christ and God forgive them, and Paul clearly says so there’s no confusion “reaffirm your love for him so that he may not be swallowed up by sorrow”

              But if anyone has caused grief, he has not grieved me, but all of you to some extent—not to be too severe. This punishment which was inflicted by the majority is sufficient for such a man, so that, on the contrary, you ought rather to forgive and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one be swallowed up with too much sorrow. Therefore I urge you to reaffirm your love to him. For to this end I also wrote, that I might put you to the test, whether you are obedient in all things. Now whom you forgive anything, I also forgive. For if indeed I have forgiven anything, I have forgiven that one for your sakes in the presence of Christ, lest Satan should take advantage of us; for we are not ignorant of his devices.

              Now I say this with kindness, so don’t take offense, but when you say you have think Jehovah feels differently about this you also in the same step are going beyond what’s written. We don’t have the mind of Jehovah although we would like to think he would feel at times as we feel. But we cannot go beyond what’s written, and if this person has truly repented God’s view spoken by the holy spirit says to forgive that man, his debt has been forgiven. Now that man has to live with the consequence of doing such a horrible thing, losing the trust of the brothers and sisters to be left in the care of him or her, but Christ said with a warning if you do not forgive your brother or sister from the heart then God will not forgive us, and I’m first partaker when I say that. I include myself as being given that command.

              “Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. And when he had begun to settle accounts, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents. But as he was not able to pay, his master commanded that he be sold, with his wife and children and all that he had, and that payment be made. The servant therefore fell down before him, saying, ‘Master, have patience with me, and I will pay you all.’ Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.
              “But that servant went out and found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii; and he laid hands on him and took him by the throat, saying, ‘Pay me what you owe!’ So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, ‘Have patience with me, and I will pay you all.’ And he would not, but went and threw him into prison till he should pay the debt. So when his fellow servants saw what had been done, they were very grieved, and came and told their master all that had been done. Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me. Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?’ And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.
              “So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”
              (Matthew 18:23-35)

              The apostle John stated that there is one sin that is unforgivable and that is the sin against the holy spirit, the sin that incurs death.

              1 John 5:19
              If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that.

              I think the problem is it’s unsettling to many because they aren’t willing to forgive such a person something like this from the heart.

              Now in saying that Kevin should feel bad for blocking me one because there was no cause and also true Christians are to put up with one another in love, if we can’t put up with one another in something like this that can be reasoned on in the Scriptures then there is no unity and no love and if there’s no unity or love them God’s spirit isn’t there. That should never happen. I think he has somewhat of a dividing spirit he always wants to divide something and create divisions where there is no division. I hope he’ll make it a subject of prayer, and I’ll pray for him. Sometimes we can justify ourselves but it’s God who reads the heart, so if your a justifying Christian this message is not for you. The only people who hate these kind of messages are self justifying Christians. The world system and the world’s view are not going to work in the kingdom, there’s the kingdom of the world and the kingdom of God and we want to be in God’s kingdom, and we want to live by his words and it says to forgive your brother and reaffirm your love for them. Now In all of my comments (if you read them) in all of them there was nothing I said and there was nothing I even suggested that children should be left alone with people who have committed sins like this or anything else that was questionable. There were others who also agreed with what I stated, I said and repeated exactly what the Scriptures teach and that is to reaffirm your love for the brother who has repented, encourage him and continue in love.

            • Song of Hannah

              Fascinating. But methinks, perhaps thou doth protest too much?

            • Joshua

              I’m not protesting I’m just telling you the truth and the truth will set you free

            • i wouldve just said thats a good question. there are more ways im sure but you made good point of that subject being one.

              you had a lot to say though

            • you lost me on this part ->
              “1 John 5:19
              If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that.”

              dont reply back with an essay please, just keep it short

            • Searcher

              Hi Hannah you make a valid point re adultery but child molestation is far worse than adultery, it’s rape. No doubt adultery has its victims, the innocent mates but the act itself is committed by consenting adults. One who is raped is subjected to physical force, coercion, abuse of authority and/or is incapable of giving valid consent. Any adult of sound mind can at least comprehend the circumstances leading to adultery between consenting adults because it’s a situation anyone of us could find ourselves in. But most of us, if not all would be horrified to know of an individual who derives sexual gratification by depriving people of their liberty and free will. Can any us of identify with an individual who is prepared to deprive a child of their liberty and innocence to satisfy their own sexual perversion. There has been much discussion on forgiveness which is divine but many in 1st world countries are merging forgiveness with political correctness, the libertarian new wave thinking of the west. There is evil in the world and to exercise caution towards any individual who is capable of engaging in any form of perversion would be wise.

              Over the years i have enjoyed reading your comments, your understanding of scripture has been encouraging to me. I appreciate how you ponder on Jehovah’s thoughts through his word.

            • Song of Hannah

              Oh my goodness Searcher, thank you so much for alerting me to my failure to bring that out! As you so accurately stated, there is no really comparison between adultery and child molestation. I really should have added what I was alluding to. What I was trying to say (but failed to do so very well) was that, if Jehovah feels this strongly about adultery, which is many times a sin of weakness, rather than wickedness – but nonetheless is a sex crime against the innocent mate – just think how much loathing and disgust he must feel about the absolutely heinous crime of child sexual molestation.

              Thanks again Searcher! ?❤️

            • no human can be 100% sure. only Jehovah. and not leavng the child alone is keeping safe out of harms way.

              if talking is some circumstance in harm then let not talking even happen.

              parents discretion with bible principles should be applied.

              if one parent doesnt want their child even around a former offender, there is no harm in that and it should be respected and yet if another parent allows their child then it of course can knowingly and will be done with caution when it is a known fact.

              that is the core problem with the WT. nothing can be done with caution because it is keep secret when it should not be and it is the elders that only know but they can not be everywhere at the same time so they do not and can not use caution while they are the only ones knowing and so it becomes a trap factory for those who have even repented or not truly repented.

              the solution is that sex offenders should be the ones themselvs letting those in the congregation know along with the elders making others awear.
              all the sex offenders details dont need to be made known but only what is necessary for the knowledge of caution.

            • Song of Hannah

              Gotta agree with you there, DA. Interestingly, some years ago a brother moved into the congregation we attended, and at once told everyone that he had been in prison for molesting children. I don’t know if he did it as a protection for himself, or for others, but I thought it was very commendable and humble of him to do so.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Just because I forgave them doesn’t mean I’m going to trust them.
              Although we may wholeheartedly forgive a person for their sin in respect to sexual child abuse even up to 77 times as the bible has counseled, we still shouldn’t let our children or child be put in harm’s way by allowing our children to associate with a known pedophile Why? – because like I mentioned before how can parents know for sure he has completely repented of his wicked ways? And would not commit sexual abuse again against a child?, thus destroying another child’s life, the truth is one cannot know for sure and a “responsible” parent would not put their child in harm’s way.
              The child’s welfare comes first “not the pedophile” who has become marked due to his own heinous crime against children.

              Excerpt:
              Bklyn Kevin sally • a day ago
              Surely the Watchtower’s policies are clearly at fault and no doubt these convicted sex offender of these heinous crimes against children are totally at fault but nonetheless there is one more guilty party and I am referring to the
              “parents / parent” who were overly “trusting” when It came to trusting their child’s welfare with so-called trusted members of any congregation, yes I’m afraid the “parents” are guilty.

              Now some of you here might get angry with me because of my opinion but the truth is the truth and the truth is you can’t really trust your children’s welfare with anybody unsupervised, – If you want to be 100% sure that no herm will come to them.

              In other words {the parents are ultimately responsible} for the safety and well being for their children and regardless of how much we trust someone whether It be out in service or a social get together ,
              “do not let your children leave your eyesight”
              regardless of how much you trust someone.

              3 Do not put your trust in princes Nor in a son of man, who cannot bring salvation.

              Isaiah 2:22 For your own sakes, quit trusting in mere man, Who is only the breath in his nostrils. Why should he be taken into account?

              Jeremiah 17:5 This is what Jehovah says: Cursed is the man* who puts his trust in mere humans, Who relies on human power, And whose heart turns away from Jehovah.

            • Joshua

              As I mentioned and all the other comments children should be left alone know someone who has had something like that happen,
              However those Bible verses you quoted are talking about and discussing putting our trust in Salvation by men, and are being taken out of context. You’re still marking them in your heart.

            • Joshua

              A good principle to use is the twenty versus principle always read twenty verses before the scripture you’re actually quoting and 20 verses after so you get the context of what’s being conveyed.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Look I’m not going to debate the the scriptures with you obviously your perception is different from what I perceive.
              Like I said the child’s welfare comes first / above all and Jesus will sort out the rest in his future Parousia.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Look I’m not going to debate the scriptures with you obviously your perception is different from what I perceive.
              Like I said the child’s welfare comes first / above all and Jesus will sort out the rest in his future parousia

            • Joshua

              There is no debate. If you don’t truly forgive from the heart then Christ will not forgive you, and that is for all Christians and those who don’t aren’t allowing themselves to be transformed into the image of Christ.
              I’m sorry if you’re upset or take offense. There’s nothing in my comments that suggested that I don’t put a child’s welfare first there’s nothing in my comments that said a child’s welfare shouldn’t be put first. A person that has committed a sin of that nature shouldn’t be left alone with children which I said in the previous comments.

              The definition literally means to let go. A good watchtower article states a few good examples;
              What Is Forgiveness?

              The Bible’s answer
              Forgiveness is the act of pardoning an offender. In the Bible, the Greek word translated “forgiveness” literally means “to let go,” as when a person does not demand payment for a debt. Jesus used this comparison when he taught his followers to pray: “Forgive us our sins, for we ourselves also forgive everyone who is in debt to us.” (Luke 11:4) Likewise, in his parable of the unmerciful slave, Jesus equated forgiveness with canceling a debt.—Matthew 18:23-35.

              We forgive others when we let go of resentment and give up any claim to be compensated for the hurt or loss we have suffered. The Bible teaches that unselfish love is the basis for true forgiveness, since love “does not keep account of the injury.”—1 Corinthians 13:4, 5.

              What forgiveness does not mean

              Condoning the offense. The Bible actually condemns those who claim that bad actions are harmless or acceptable.—Isaiah 5:20.
              Pretending that the offense never happened. God forgave King David of serious sins, but he did not shield David from the consequences of his actions. God even had David’s sins recorded so that they are remembered today.—2 Samuel 12:9-13.
              Allowing others to take advantage of you. Suppose, for example, that you loan money to someone, but he wastes it and then cannot repay you as he had promised. He is very sorry and apologizes to you. You could choose to forgive him by not harboring resentment, not rehashing the matter with him continually, and perhaps even canceling the debt altogether. However, you might also choose not to loan him any more money.
              (The principle can still apply to child abuse a person cannot be trusted to be alone with children

              —Psalm 37:21; Proverbs 14:15; 22:3; Galatians 6:7.
              Pardoning with no valid basis. God does not forgive people who are guilty of willful, malicious sin and who refuse to acknowledge their mistakes, change their ways, and apologize to those whom they have hurt. (Proverbs 28:13; Acts 26:20; Hebrews 10:26) Such unrepentant ones become God’s enemies, and he does not require us to forgive those whom he has not forgiven.—Psalm 139:21, 22.
              What if you are the victim of cruel mistreatment by someone who refuses to apologize or even admit to what he has done? The Bible advises: “Let go of anger and abandon rage.” (Psalm 37:8) While not excusing the error, you can refuse to be consumed with anger. Trust that God will bring the person to account. (Hebrews 10:30, 31) You can also take comfort in knowing that God will bring a time when we will no longer feel the deep pain or hurt that may burden us now.—Isaiah 65:17; Revelation 21:4.

              How to forgive someone

              Remember what forgiveness involves. You are not condoning the wrong or acting as if it never happened—you are simply letting it go.
              Recognize the benefits of forgiving. Letting go of anger and resentment can help you to keep calm, improve your health, and increase your happiness. (Proverbs 14:30; Matthew 5:9) Even more important, forgiving others is a key to receiving God’s forgiveness for your own sins.—Matthew 6:14, 15.

              And some good examples of forgives can be found in the parables from Christ himself.

              The meal begins, with the guests reclining at the table. As they eat, a woman quietly enters the room uninvited. She is “known in the city to be a sinner.” (Luke 7:37) All imperfect humans are sinners, yet this woman seems to be living an immoral life, perhaps as a prostitute. She may have heard Jesus’ teachings, including his invitation for ‘all those who are loaded down to come to him for refreshment.’ (Matthew 11:28, 29) Apparently moved by Jesus’ words and deeds, she has now sought him out.

              She comes up behind Jesus at the table and kneels at his feet. Tears fall from her eyes onto his feet, and she wipes them with her hair. She tenderly kisses his feet and pours on them some fragrant oil that she has brought. Simon watches with disapproval, saying to himself: “If this man were really a prophet, he would know who and what kind of woman it is who is touching him, that she is a sinner.”—Luke 7:39.

              A debtor gratefully thanks a lender, as another debtor walks away
              Perceiving Simon’s thinking, Jesus says: “Simon, I have something to say to you.” He replies: “Teacher, say it!” Jesus continues: “Two men were debtors to a certain lender; the one was in debt for 500 denarii, but the other for 50. When they did not have anything to pay him back with, he freely forgave them both. Therefore, which one of them will love him more?” Perhaps with an air of indifference, Simon answers: “I suppose it is the one whom he forgave more.”—Luke 7:40-43.

              Jesus agrees. Then looking at the woman, he says to Simon: “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave me no water for my feet. But this woman wet my feet with her tears and wiped them off with her hair. You gave me no kiss, but this woman, from the hour that I came in, did not stop tenderly kissing my feet. You did not pour oil on my head, but this woman poured perfumed oil on my feet.” Jesus could see that this woman was giving evidence of heartfelt repentance for her immoral life. So he concludes: “I tell you, her sins, many though they are, are forgiven, because she loved much. But the one who is forgiven little, loves little.

              Forgiveness also means not keeping account of the injury it’s the reason Jesus came and lived and gave his life to forgive us when we didn’t deserve forgiveness. That doesn’t mean we allow our children to to be trusted alone with someone who has a history of child abuse

            • ewatchman

              Jehovah bases his forgiveness on an offender’s repentance. And there are instances where God did not consent to forgive. In the law that Christ gave in the 18th chapter of Matthew Christ explained that a person who refuses to acknowledge his offense is to be treated as a tax collector. In other words, we are not required to forgive such a person. When a sexual abuser denies his crimes or blames the victim, no one is obligated to forgive such a person of their sins.

            • Joshua

              Yes that’s true, and some haven’t repented, or they repeat the same things many times, some do repent though and continue like David to suffer consequences for their sins like David, but as Christians we should if some has repented forgive them from the heart. Good to see you Robert. I hope your doin good. Good to hear from you.

            • Joshua

              The Watchtower may have refused to acknowledge this man’s send whatever it was but it sounded like he was repentant and the offense was over 20 years ago I think I saw that you commented that he said he wasn’t going in the ministry anymore because he didn’t want to hurt others by what he was doing

            • ewatchman

              I am sure he has repented. That is not the point. The Watchtower’s policy to allow convicted sexual offenders to go to people’s homes and knock on their doors is the issue. Bethel’s lawyers are the ones who need to repent.

            • Joshua

              I’m not agreeing with the watchtower or disagreeing, if he was a habitual offender I would understand but this person wouldn’t be able to have a ministry or give a witness to the great work God has done in his life by creating within him a new heart, how can he go and make disciples if he’s or any repentant wrongdoer has done? The government’s and secular authorities are behind some of the worst sex ring scandals there are, People say, It doesn’t sound like forgiveness if he hasn’t been forgiven, love doesn’t keep account of the injury. Christ will make all things known, interestingly I’m surprised that more is not said in Scripture specifically about child abuse like this, God knows. Has anyone suggested to the watchtower to allow these brothers or sisters to participate in letter writing or informal witnessing? Perhaps they haven’t thought of it. I do know I’ve seen false brothers and false witnesses on both sides of the line inside the organization and apostates supposedly exposing it, alot of things going on in these last days

            • Song of Hannah

              BTW brother, really appreciated your point a while ago that the Police could readily serve as the “second witness” to these crimes! Excellent point!

            • Joshua

              But I’m thinking of how this man is treated in the congregation by other brothers and sisters, or those cool want to be a part of Christ congregation when it’s established, truly forgiving someone means truly forgiving someone not just putting on the pretense that they’ve been forgiven, butt only Jehovah can read the hearts and Christ but I don’t think that should cause us to stop forgiving people because we can’t read hearts

            • ewatchman

              Forgiveness has nothing to do with it. He can be forgiven. He can be accepted as a brother. But he should not be allowed to go to a private home as a minister. That is the issue.

            • Sam

              I agree Kevin. David was truly forgiven by Jehovah but he still had to face the consequences of his sin even many years later.

      • Joel

        Even as I agree with your comment, bklyn Kevin, I think bro. Joshua was speaking in a general broad sense.

        Of course, no one can read the heart of an individual, and their secret intentions. One can only go by outward public appearances. And in the case of this Brother, he indeed appears to have cleaned up his life and turned it more directly in the guidance of Jesus Christ. So let’s give him the benefit of the doubt, as they say. But to him we lovingly yet sternly add . . .

        PLEASE PREACH IN ANOTHER FASHION! DO NOT GO DOOR-TO-DOOR EVER AGAIN!

        I like the way Joshua summed it up:

        “When someone repents, and truly repents, that is a testimonial to Christ and the holy spirit that repentance is possible for those who search for God and turn around.”

        Yes, may we all feel the same way.

        . . . but keep that guy away from kids? Please!!!

        • Bklyn Kevin

          Like you said just keep him away from the children.
          And when Jesus comes in his authentic parousia and verifies that this gentleman has completely repented and then and only then will I trust him.

          • Joel

            That’s the only REAL way to be sure. I agree Brother!

      • and even if he is repented, i liken it to a repented alcoholic, why place a former alcoholic who has repented into an environment or situation like a bar full of alcohol that will tempt em after having continued work in faith twards serving Jehovah?

      • the answer to that is easy. by their actions. and two, only Jehovah knows the heart. nobody can know for sure about anyone, sex offender or not. thats why we do not but our trust in men and only Jehovah can see the heart.

    • Joel

      I totally agree Joshua. Keep those good scriptural opinions coming!

    • thats right. a term Kevin helped me to get my thoughts across is fault-finders. they are stereotyping bias bigots not looking for truth but just pointing fingers unfairly out of hate. they judeg without the love of God but by their own ways, that is why there is enmity between the two. you pretty much said it well and its also true they are persecuting Christ like a slap in the face

  • Basavaraj Of North Karnataka

    The GB says that media tells lies whenever the media highlights about certain JWS offenses. But now the convicted himself claims he has done so, I think the culprit is more truthful in accepting than GB.

  • Kevin b

    Right after 911 I listened to Glenn Beck for a few years trying to figure out world events. He would talk about pedophiles from time to time. He said the only cure was to put them in a grinder, problem solved. Point being you can’t cure a pedophile. That is a bit extreme. Just like a alcoholic falling off the wagon, Given the right opportunity a pedophile can fall off the wagon in a since. Bottom line don’t be alone with a child. Going from house to house in service is well and good, but you could find yourself in a bad situation very quickly. Our job as parents is to protect our children. We can’t protect them from a pedophile in the congregation if we don’t know about it. The pedophile could be benefiting from the “spiritual paradise” taking advantage of the situation, waiting for the right opportunity. I say forgive but don’t forget.

    • Joel

      Sounds Stern, but excellent advice. In total agreement.

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