Downfall of America – 2018?

//Downfall of America – 2018?

It is natural to ponder what each new year may bring. In these beginning days of 2018 it seems especially fitting for people of faith to do so; the reason being, because, even from a casual assessment it certainly seems that the world has never been more perilously close to nuclear war.

Ironically, though, from the perspective of Jehovah’s Witnesses the world’s present situation is largely irrelevant. That is because the Watchtower sets our expectations based upon the Governing Body’s understanding of prophecy. And according to the Watchtower the only thing left unfulfilled —other than the attack of Gog and the war of Armageddon —is the destruction of organized religion by the United Nations.

On that front there is nothing notable to report. It is more likely that Earth will be struck by the mythical Planet X than that the U.N. might initiate the violent destruction of Babylon the Great. Seriously, though, besides the fact that the U.N. is a toothless tiger and could not possibly bring about the eradication of all religious institutions globally, at least not in the current political environment and ordering of nations, there is no indication that the powers-that-be are even inclined to do so. On the contrary, religion does not appear to have lost any measurable influence.

In Russia, for instance, the Orthodox Church is more powerful than it has ever been in the last 100 years —since the Bolshevik revolution —evidenced by the shocking liquidation of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia in 2017. Or are we to pretend that the Orthodox Church was not behind the ban?

By all accounts evangelicals in the United States are thriving too, as can be seen by the phenomenon of teeming mega churches.

Meanwhile, in the U.S. the Watchtower dissolved nearly 500 congregations in 2017 alone. (See graphic below) Dozens of fully functional kingdom halls have been shuttered and dumped on the real estate market. Far from the waters of Babylon drying up, as the brothers used to be fond of saying, it is the Watchtower that is experiencing a steady erosion of support. Surely, if it were not for the baptism of younger and younger children in recent years and the Service Department allowing 15-minute monthly field service reports, the numbers of active publishers in America and Europe would surely reveal negative “growth.” No wonder the Governing Body decided to stop publishing the Year Book. As Paul might say, your cause for boasting is not fine.

Be that as it may, what about the coming year?

While no human can foresee the future, we appreciate that Jehovah has amply demonstrated that he is fully capable of doing so.  And he has published his vision of the future in the Bible. The challenge for us is to accurately interpret the enigmatic mysteries God has presented in the books of the prophets. Admittedly, that may require some imagination in such instances where the prophecies have not been fulfilled yet. The problem is, though, Jehovah’s Witnesses see no need to examine the Scriptures. The reason being, the Watchtower has convinced those under its influence that virtually everything has already been fulfilled —except the aforementioned.

But is it the sole obligation of loyal Jehovah’s Witnesses to unquestioningly accept whatever comes from Bethel? If so, why does the apostle exhort individual Christians to “not believe every inspired statement, but test the inspired statements to see whether they originate with God”? Are the teachings of the Watchtower somehow exempt from scrutiny? If so, by whose authority?

If Jehovah’s Witnesses were to test the “inspired statements” published by the Watchtower, what might the results of such a test reveal? Take the book of Daniel as an example. The seventh chapter presents a vision Daniel received concerning a succession of wild beasts, the last of which has a fatal encounter with the newly enthroned Son of man. While there is no reason to question the identity of the beasts themselves, what about the 11th horn of the unusually fearsome monster that emerges last and the three horns that are “plucked up” by it, thereby transforming the Romish creature into an eight-horned beast?

As you likely know, the Watchtower’s last commentary on Daniel was published nearly 20 years ago, entitled: Pay Attention to Daniel’s Prophecy. (The Pay Attention commentary was largely a rehash of Your Will Be Done, published in 1958.)

According to the Watchtower the little horn is said to have been the British Empire and the United States of America. And the three horns that are plucked up before it? — Spain, France and Holland.

However, there are a number of things that do not add up. First, there is no indication in Daniel’s prophecy that the plucking up of the three horns transpires over the course of several centuries. No, the act of plucking out suggests a sudden and simultaneous fall of three kings. Yet, the defeat of the Spanish Armada took place in 1588, but France was not eclipsed by British naval supremacy until the Battle of Trafalgar in 1805 —more than two centuries later!

Even more troublesome, the act of being “plucked up” suggests that those three kings no longer have any power after they are uprooted. Indeed, the King James words it: “plucked up buy the roots,” while Byington simply says “uprooted.”

The problem with the Watchtower’s interpretation arises due to the fact that Spain, Netherlands and France are still very much ruling powers. France especially, being one of the foremost military powers and a member of the exclusive G-8 economic club and a permanent member on the U.N. Security Council. Who would dispute that France wields as much national clout as Great Britain? Not only is France’s economy essentially on par with that of Britain, it has more nuclear weapons. If that is not an expression of power, what is? Not to be overlooked, France was allied with Great Britain in both world wars. So how can it be said that the great nation of France has fallen before its British rival? What rational person would believe such a preposterous thing?

If we accept the Watchtower’s “inspired statement” as being authentic, which is to say we believe that the wrecking of a few dozen wooden warships in a North Atlantic gale in 1588 fulfilled prophecy, then we must assume that the three horns have long since been grafted back into the head of the beast from where they had been “plucked up” —rendering this aspect of Daniel’s prophecy into a mere historical footnote. And most unsettling, that  leaves us with no alternative but to believe that God inspired Daniel to record mere trivia that has no relevancy to the present or future. Frankly, why ought the Creator stoop to using his unlimited foreknowledge to play such parlor tricks?

We may be certain that Jehovah does not use his power to foretell irrelevant trivialities. The Watchtower’s interpretation is very much in error. The purpose of Daniel’s prophecy is to reveal events related to the establishment of God’s Kingdom. Since the little horn with eyes and a mouth speaks in opposition to the Christ at the point he comes against them, that is also when the three rival horns are uprooted.

Unfortunately, the Watchtower’s error does not end there. Since the ascendency of the big-talking little horn parallels the revival of the slaughtered head of the beast in the 13th chapter of Revelation, who is similarly depicted as being given a mouth to utter great blasphemies against heaven for precisely the same prophetic period of 42 months, alternatively expressed in Daniel as a time, times and half a time, the mortal blow to the head of the seven-headed beast must coincide with the three kings that are made to fall.

Of course, the Watchtower makes no such connection. Rivaling the absurdity of the interpretation of the three horns being plucked out, Jehovah’s Witnesses are compelled by the masters of their faith to believe that the head of the wild beast —the Anglo-American duo —suffered a fatal blow during the First World War and then miraculously recovered. It is true, the First World War changed the world and millions of young men were senselessly slaughtered, but Jehovah’s Witnesses are apparently oblivious to the fact that the Anglo-American allies were victorious in the war and experienced nothing that could even remotely be described as a fatal blow.

The reason the Watchtower is compelled to resort to extolling such nonsense is because Bethel’s visionaries well know that the head of the beast is slaughtered as an indirect result of Christ coming to power and Satan being cast down to the earth. And the doctrine that Christ began ruling the world in 1914 is considered the sacred foundation upon which the Watchtower has been built and cannot be questioned.

But it gets even worse. Did you know that America was subjugated by the Soviet Union during the Cold War? Most people do not. In fact, the only people on the planet who believe it are Jehovah’s Witnesses, although I doubt that it is something foremost in their minds. No doubt the reason the Watchtower can pass off sheer nonsense as if it were an inspired statement from God is because Jehovah’s Witnesses respect “the slave” as being from God. And it would seem that “the slave” has exploited Jehovah’s Witnesses lack of education and knowledge of modern history.

But surely no knowledgable person would agree that the Soviet communists dominated America in the way outlined in Daniel’s prophecy, so as to “rule over the hidden treasures of gold and silver and over all the desirable things.” Yet, this is what the Watchtower has unblushingly taught for the past 60 years –even after the USSR was driven into bankruptcy by America in the arms race. 

Interestingly, the verse above goes on to relate that Egypt does not escape, nor do the Libyans or Ethiopians. Those three symbolic entities must represent the same kings as the three horns that are uprooted, making the little horn the same entity as the king of the north in his final campaign.

The truth is, and there is really no polite way to say it, the Watchtower has perpetrated a massive fraud upon Jehovah’s Witnesses. Christ did not begin ruling in 1914. Furthermore, the 11th horn did not emerge in 1588. Nor was the wild beast mortally wounded in 1914. And for certain, the king of the north did not subjugate the king of the south during the Cold War. All of these things are in our immediate future. And you may be certain that the fulfillment of God’s prophetic word will not be so easily forgotten as the defeat of the Spanish Armada. The return of Christ will be immensely profound.

A GREAT CRASH IS COMING

What is symbolized in various prophecy is the utter crash of the system and  afterwards —like the mythical phoenix arising from the ashes —the emergence of the last king, the eighth king —the little horn of Daniel’s prophecy. The plucking up of the three horns will undoubtedly be realized with the collapse of the United States and her supporters, probably Britain and France. 

Already the move to replace the U.S. Dollar as the world’s reserve currency is well along. That means the U.S. will be swamped by a Tsunami of worthless Dollars nations no longer need. There is no way America will survive as an independent republic. It will be crushed by its own massive mountain of unpayable debt –foreclosed upon by its central bank creditors, who will likely take possession of the hidden treasures at Fort Knox and whatever else is deemed valuable. A deathblow indeed! 

The significance of the impending downfall of America, at least as far as Jehovah’s Witnesses are concerned, is that America has always protected the rights of its citizens to freely assemble, to preach and publish the truth. No one has benefited from America’s guarantee of freedom more than Jehovah’s Witnesses. But all of that will change. The land of the free it will be no more. 

Likely Jehovah’s Witnesses will scoff (until it happens), having been conditioned to believe the Watchtower is virtually unerring. How could ‘Bethel have it so wrong,’ many will likely retort? That is actually a good question. And Jehovah has the answer: “Who is blind except my servant, so deaf as the messenger I send? Who is so blind as the one rewarded, so blind as the servant of Jehovah? You see many things, but you do not keep watch. You open your ears, but you do not listen.”

Jehovah’s assessment is right on the mark. Over the past century the Watchtower has published volumes on prophecy. True, most of it has long since been consigned to the rubbish bin; but in recent years the Watchtower doesn’t even concern itself with prophecy. It has turned the prophets into behavioral lessons for the learners. Now, as the world stands at the brink of a holocaust, the like of which has never occurred before or will ever occur again, the prophet class has gone mute. How true, even as Jehovah long ago said of his servant, “you see many things, but you do not keep watch.”

Amazingly, the far-seeing God foresaw the Watchtower’s 1914 hoax and describes it in the 30th chapter of Isaiah, saying: “Since you reject this word and you trust in fraud and deceit and you rely on these, so this error will be for you like a broken wall, like a bulging high wall ready to fall. It will crash suddenly, in an instant. It will be broken like a large potter’s jar, so completely smashed that no fragment among its pieces will be left to rake the fire from the fireplace or to scoop water from a puddle.”

Surely a bulging, high wall, is the perfect analogy for the Watchtower’s interpretation of prophecy, all of which has been tied to 1914. It may seem impressive to the over-awed observer. And surely the leadership of Jehovah’s Witnesses support themselves on it by declaring themselves to be the already appointed princes of the now-ruling Kingdom. But what happens when the cruise missiles and nuclear ICBM’s start flying? Crash!!! the wall comes down and is shattered to smithereens.

As it stands presently, a few of Jehovah’s Witnesses are waking up to the reality of a future presence of Christ during the reign of the yet-to-come eighth king —the yet-to ascend little horn. Although the leadership of the Watchtower are committed to keeping Jehovah’s people in ignorance, the wall of deceit is bulging more and more.

I take inspiration from one of the pioneer English Bible translators, William Tyndale, who said to one of his many resisters: “I defy the Pope and all his laws. If God spare my life, ere many years I will cause a boy that driveth the plough shall know more of the Scripture than thou doest.”

Indeed, I defy the Watchtower and their judicial injunction against independently examining the Scriptures. And if God spares my life a few more years I am certain to see a goodly number of insignificant publishers and disfellowshipped castaways come to know more of the prophetic Scriptures than the Governing Body and all their helpers.

Watchtower 2017 field service report
2018-01-12T04:22:28+00:00 January 4th, 2018|Page One|171 Comments
  • Island Breeze
    • I bet they don’t allow any transgender freaks in that outfit. lol

      • Island Breeze
        • Craig Knight

          Island breeze – Thanks for the laughs – Caitlyn Jenner will be good for that role. LOL!!!

      • Revv_zone@gmail.com Please8834

        Can see it all now.. Chinese guys lined up in boots..American guys dressed like flame burgers in high heals while parachuting out of airplanes in their skirts running around the battlefield trying to find transgender bathroom… LOL

      • Bonnie Russell

        LOL! What irks me is everything is all about PC culture now. I can see being accepting and tolerant up to a point when it comes to letting people make their own decisions, but when it comes to putting other people at risk you got to be realistic. You can’t even join the army if you have Tourette syndrome or depression or flat feet. Transgenderism should be no different. You don’t want somebody on your team with a severe mental illness. It could jeopardize the whole squad.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDAU3SPYFsA

      • Burt Reynolds

        Don’t ask, don’t tell! Law of average…80 in every million, and about 3000 wishing!

  • so many things in this article have been on my mind

  • Max

    Great article!! and here is how we move closer and closer to Daniel’s fulfilment and closer to our liberation from slavery. May Jehovah The Reveler of Secrets bless you richly brother King.

  • Paul H

    Thanks Robert! I feel stuffed with spiritual food today 🙂

  • Craig Knight

    Luke 12: 42 The Lord answered, “Who then is the faithful and wise manager, whom the master puts in charge of his servants to give them their food allowance at the proper time?

    Notice the faithful and wise manager is appointed by Christ himself. – The GB have appointed themselves. The wise servant also gives food at the proper time according to Luke. All the GB’s false predictions are proof that they are not giving out spiritual food at the proper time. Stumbling Christ’s sheep is not a wise thing to do.

    43 It will be good for that servant whom the master finds doing so when he returns. 44 Truly I tell you, he will put him in charge of all his possessions.

    If Christ already returned in 1914 – How have the GB been put in charge of all his possessions? Again it’s Christ who puts the faithful servant in charge – they are not self appointed as the GB suggest.

    45 But suppose the servant says to himself, ‘My master is taking a long time in coming,’ and he then begins to beat the other servants, both men and women, and to eat and drink and get drunk. 46 The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the unbelievers.

    Jesus returned 104 years ago according to the wizards at WT. Obviously Christ’s real return is going to be an unexpected time for the GB member’s and loyal JW’s. They will find themselves lost like the unbeliever’s at that time.

    • Just so ya know, the WT no longer teaches that the slave has already been appointed over all the master’s possessions. They revised that back in 2013, prompting me to write a seven part series of articles covering their revision. Here is part one https://e-watchman.com/watchtower-review-for-jehovahs-witnesses-pt-1/

      • Craig Knight

        Hi Robert! Thanks for that 7 part series. I just got finished reading them all. It’s pretty amazing the lengths WT will go to to hold onto their 1914 garbage. WT sure likes to have it both ways don’t they? If Jesus already arrived how in the world is He supposed to arrive again during the Great Tribulation? I guess that’s his 3rd coming. I wish they would just man up and drop this nonsense! I pasted in WT’s new ideas below and your comments for other’s to see.

        WT:
        In the verses that lead up to Matthew 24:46, the word “coming” refers consistently to the time when Jesus comes to pronounce and execute judgment during the great tribulation. (Matt. 24:30, 42, 44) Also, as we considered in paragraph 12, Jesus’ ‘arriving’ mentioned at Matthew 25:31 refers to that same future time of judgment. So it is reasonable to conclude that Jesus’ arrival to appoint the faithful slave over all his belongings, mentioned at Matthew 24:46, 47, also applies to his future coming, during the great tribulation. Indeed, a consideration of Jesus’ prophecy in its entirety makes it clear that each of these eight references to his coming applies to the future time of judgment during the great tribulation.

        RK:
        Jehovah’s Witnesses around the world may be shocked to learn that this latest adjustment did not originate with Bethel. I don’t know what is going on behind closed doors, but perhaps after many hours of boardroom wrangling a hardline faction within the Governing Body or maybe upon the Society’s board of directors, has now reluctantly given into the moderates, at least partially, and accepted the view originally expounded on this website and through direct correspondence with numerous individuals and department heads at Bethel going back to the late 90’s.

        The fact of the matter is, for the past decade the future judgment of the house of God, which is really what this article is implying although it does not explicitly say so, has been the primary focus of e-Watchman. How else can the expression “the future time of judgment” be understood? It is astonishing to me, though, that the Watchtower can make such a profound change in such a casual manner and neglect to expound upon the implications of their latest and perhaps most far-reaching “adjustment.” But whether they admit it or not, the fact of the matter is, they have completely repudiated their long-held notion that Jesus came to the spiritual temple and judged the house of God in 1918. They have repudiated their teaching that the bridegroom arrived in the dead of the night back then and the wise and foolish virgins have long since parted ways. They have repudiated their teaching that Jesus came and called his slaves to account as regards the talents that the master had entrusted to them. Regardless of the comparatively trivial point of distinction as to whether Jesus’ coming and arrival initiates the parousia or the tribulation, whether intentional or not, in the span of a couple of paragraphs the Watchtower has casually telegraphed to Jehovah’s Witnesses that Christ has not come to inspect his congregation yet, nor have the people of God been made to pass under the rod of Jehovah’s judgment. “Let he that has an ear hear what the spirit says to the congregation.” Of course, as only the Watchtower can do, they then proceed to contradict the very thing they have implied, as will be shown in the next article.

  • please help us Jehovah

  • Bonnie Russell

    I had always wondered why so many JWs today are completely uninformed or dare I say uninterested in world events today. This article explains it. They don’t see a need because they think almost everything has already happened. It’s almost like they have fallen asleep. Very interesting.

    • Good morning!

    • Isaac of Coimbatore

      They have not fallen asleep Just open your bible and read Isaiah :42:19

      Also read Isaiah:29:4 how Jehovah considers the prophecies of Governing body.

      Also read Jer:5:28-31 What will you do when end comes if you keep on believing WTS.

      Also read ;Jer:7:4 why you should not give Godly reverence to organization.

      Finally read: Duet:18:20-22 why we should not fear Governing body?

    • they are not only uninterested because things are tought as history pased but because they are simply NOT interested and do not care and even cover up the truth by not talking about what truth needs to be addresed for the safty and well being of the sheep. they are fake. when there is a known database of 20,000 sicko sexual predators lurking in the congragations around the world and you attempt to inform them about this then they stop talking to you and shun you before you can even say anything about it. they put on a front as if they are out in service to tell the truth but when they are approched to talk about the truth then they defeat the purpose of saying anying because they do not care, they are uninterested and fake. if they were trully serving Jehovah then they would lose sleep over the truth and be eager with zeal to eat the gold of information out of your hand and Jehovah would have sonething to make grow. but they stand or sit next to a book stand and do nothing for hours not talking to anyone. just dressed up in different attire and talk artificially while they spread bad rumors about those who wish to speak truth. it is not simy because things are taught as passed events but because they dont care about the truth and act aginst it

    • “Uninterested” is what I think.

      This morning I emailed a few hundred elders this article. About 10 responded, all negatively, demanding that I remove their emails from my list. Some felt the need to punctuate their requests with multiple exclamation marks!!!! lol I suppose they imagine they are being loyal to Jehovah by remaining in a state of ignorance. None seem even slightly aware of the hypocrisy of a JW objecting to receiving an unsolicited Bible-based message. It’s ridiculous. No wonder some say JW’s are a brainwashed cult. I finder it harder and harder to argue otherwise.

      • just read your reply now. i said the same thing finishing a reply i attempted to wright last night. im so fedup with them. i get more joy out of talking with people of some other religion sometimes, if they arent a total zombie.
        you took words out of my mouth

      • Island Breeze

        Absolutely Totally brainwashed, 100%.
        Will not investigate anything on their own.
        Jim Jones 2.0

      • Burt Reynolds

        I agree. It is easier at times to feel that way as we strive against not just an unrequited spiritual love, but their unexplainable fear of lifting the lid of Pandora’s box. Personally, I’m not convinced that they feel ignorant. To the contrary, I, as I am sure we all were at one time, resting easy in the self satisfaction that we were right. Just as much as you feel right now, and as I feel you are too as well as all here. So much so, that I believe there is no other place to look for truth. Yes there are some supporting parties, speaking the same language, but these other quiz masters…..irksome.

        I see a negative danger in the unconscious lumping together of the misled with the evil intent within the watchtower. I find myself increasingly drawn into it because the fact that the sheep cannot see and are lost, produces the same symptoms as those who work evil within the watchtower. Can we divide? And yet, Jesus went after those very ones who are blind, stubborn, recalcitrant and lost, even if there was just one, but Jesus made a clear distinction between them and their pharisaical leaders and their ilk….’you are from your father the devil.’

        We each had our own trigger that opened our eyes, but these unfortunate ones have yet to feel theirs. We rejoice at sheep arriving here. There must be more. The way I keep a head on it, oddly, is likening the problem to a huge box of old mixed screws I have? When I am looking for a match to the one I have, I always have the view that there is always one remaining. And to date, I have never been disappointed. Let’s try to keep positive like our Isaac in india!

        • The Raven

          I agree. I can’t paint with a broad brush. I’ve known some in the past and we have many here now who understand. There’s no way at present to know how many active jws are awakened. I always had the suspicion something strange was going on with them and once I read Robert’s work, understood what that is. Scripture speaks volumes about their leaders and their punishment so I ain’t too worried about rushing anything. It will all be revealed and set right in good time. In these days do they not fulfill the very descriptions given if them in Ezekiel, Isaiah and others? It’s a marvel to me to know this. It confirms their identity like no others. This is one test they can’t study for having been blind and deaf all this time. It appears we are not all given the same test. Knowing this brings its own issues, it seems. Makes me wonder.

        • ISAIAH 10:15-22 / MICAH 2:12; 4:7 .

        • I am positive. I am positively sure that Jehovah is going to hold an accounting. The GB are most accountable. But elders are too, although to a lesser extent. That is why in the letter of James it says teachers will receive a heavier judgment. I don’t push my stuff on rank and file JW’s unsolicited. But I do contact elders. I have since my first mass mailing in 2005.

          • Burt Reynolds

            If anyone can come up with addresses I’ll push your stuff on the population of rank and file!

          • Jamie Mac

            Hi Robert, here’s a question which I thought of asking you for a while. Do you ever lie awake at night wondering what awaits you and if you will be prepared when Jesus comes alongside you. It must be a wonderful thing for you just waiting for Jesus. I paint a rosy picture here, but is there anything that frightens you about your immediate future.

            • If I have given the impression of being fearless and carefree, that was not intentional. Like Paul said to the Philippians, ‘I do not consider myself as having laid hold of it’ (the prize) For all that i have written about the things to come, and as earnestly as I believe I am right, that doesn’t give me any sort of inside track on salvation. I lay awake plenty. Jehovah terrifies me.

            • The Raven

              This will probably sound off but you have no idea how happy it makes me to read this.

            • Jamie Mac

              Hope you don’t mind me asking Raven, why does it make you happy

            • Jamie Mac

              Thanks for your reply. Perhaps Proverbs 9:10 springs to mind. How true that is.

            • The Raven

              Who would you trust more? A man who fears God and loses sleep over these matters or one who behaves like he is above it all as some among the society do? Robert gives us in unvarnished detail what others will have you believe is a future of rainbows and daffodils or at the very worst, the idea that we will be merely a spectator among unprecedented upheaval. No sugar coating here and even he, one who is called readily confesses this. I won’t ever understand how one called really feels but I don’t need to. I can see the fruits of their spirit. And so far he’s managed quite a bit in his present role as a watchman. I hope he maintains that attitude up til Christ arrives.

              That verse you just posted is exactly the same one Kevin gave me when I first arrived here and told him my fear of God was my motivation for searching for His truth after the wt basically wrote me off. He will probably remember this. lol.

            • Jamie Mac

              Hi Raven, you and I are having a nice discussion today. Really enjoying it. I did actually delete the comment which you have just answered as I felt I was prying and I did not want you to reveal anything you did not want to. I understand your response and agree with everything you said or typed 🙂

            • The Raven

              lol! I tried to reply and couldn’t the first time leading me to think discus was about to mess with my head. But I don’t see the question as prying at all given what I said. Even now, we get an idea of who’s doing what among Jehovah’s people and those who are at the gate, like some of us. Looks like Max also feels that way. 🙂

            • Max

              Your comment is so comforting… I thought I was crazy for feeling that way.

            • Jehovah or pain, suffering and death?

            • i know i do constantly.

              that is a good question cause it shows that you are thinking in care/concern for your brother, no?

          • The voice

            I have been working inside the congregations. Being careful of who I speak with but trying to awake others before the fall.

            • Max

              With all due respect brother just be very careful what you are doing and how you doing it. The sheeps are the most precious possession of the King and if one of them goes strayed because of what you said then you might be responsible for the loss of a life. We are not the e-watchman so we have not received a commission from Jehovah to awake the sheep. If Jehovah wanted them awakened by now they would have been awakened long ago.

            • The voice

              And how would you know if it is not the spirit directing me to do so. With all the corruption,lies and deceit that is permeating the organization we here know its going to fall since its seems to be under judgement at this time. People at that point will have to make the choice, Jehovah or the organization

            • e.v.g

              Jesus did stumble many when he spoke about his blood and flesh. It has to do with condition of heart, probably we are not so humble as we believe or we don’t have the right motives. Someone could stumble according to the condition of heart. Making stumble someone with a bad reason, that is dangerous.

            • The voice

              Take into consideration the thousands or perhaps10,s of thousands that have stumbled and fell and even committed suicide because of the actions of those in the organization. I know of 2 that have so i guess thats better

            • Island Breeze

              I know of three local area suicides, active Jws. One was a 40 plus year elder. (Kindest man you’d ever meet.)

            • Why not just take some sleeping pills? What’s with yanking your head off? Sounds like he had some serious mental issues, far beyond anything the WT could have laid on him.

            • Island Breeze

              I know, right
              Bizarre to say the least. He was a gentle kind soul. Unfortunately his daughter found him…….

            • Cathii D’Anthonii

              The elders are not trained to help people with mental illness, nor are they trained in the nuances of an alcoholic and the games of misdirection, and drug addicted people who need serious help. The friends that suffer with depression was not even recognized as a genuine illness for many years.. Suicide is horrific especially on the family….Thank Jehovah every minute that this will soon be over…i look forward to seeing these people again…

            • the bible equips those who wish to take the lead as a shepherd, if they cant handle it then they need to step down. saying im not trained to take care of the sheep is bull and not an excuse. sheep get sick weather mental or whatever and the scriptures are perfect and backed by Jehovah

            • Cathii D’Anthonii

              Then why does Jesus have to strike the shepards and scatter the sheep??? I will continue to pray for the kingdom and for you

            • Zech 13

              because they are doing such a fine job walking by Jehovah’s spirit and regulations and in no way harming the sheep and speaking deception in Jehovah’s name but are actually carrying out their responsibilities in taking good care of the flock as they are expected or appointed by Jehovah to do. (sarcasam off*) how is that a question? you really dont know?

            • Burt Reynolds

              Absolutely right, and the watchtower mindset leaves no room for leeway or considered bible based mercy. It is mostly black and white from the watchtower perspective except where it threatens their status, as with child abuse. One either tows the line or not….my watchtower right or wrong. Worse, the more pious and strict the elders are, the more approval they get by those who feel equal to them. It is a very dangerous set-up for vulnerable people. There are more people scared of leaving, those those who stay because of their misplaced belief in the watchtower faith.

            • e.v.g

              The apostasy will brake the faith of many. Those who are strong in faith inside the watchtower will tremble ( and I along with them) but I have faith that some sons of God will prevail for the benefit of us.

            • Burt Reynolds

              Not wishing to teach my granny how to suck eggs, but you may under estimate the conflict in mind that the watchtower is capable of inflicting and the sense of worthlessness it engenders in a person. Putting aside the fact that each person personally perceives his own crisis within the bounds of his own reasoning, there are many people who do not have the sense of self worth, independance of mind to act and stand their ground, or the strength to express it. It is difficult for even those of a strong character, sometimes, to understand the impact of an apparant feeling of worthlessness upon the soul. Self harming, starving of self, even a death of a loved one can all be symptoms of, or the causal root of it.

              In the course of my work, I worked with a gent who ate himself to death and died of asphyxiation at just under 60 stone. No medical professional would help him because he was deemed mentally fit….in other words, it was his choice. The fact is, we none of us have insight into the complexity of perception as related to feeling and response because we take the norm as a given standard. Though it normally suffices as a standard measure, within that is an infinite determination of reality for the individual. Thus we see the example Stephen gave of that poor man’s suicide and the likely act of self punishment he wanted to inflict on himself to ‘pay’ for his perceived sin.

              This is the murderous denial that those of the evil slave sleep in. Even those thinking they are doing righteous work from the safety and luxuriant mental approval of the governing body, have little idea of the strain and unhappiness they inflict on their brethren on behalf of the governing body. They tear from the soul a whole life’s vocation and make it worthless, driving people to despair, whittling away at their faith, changing the goal posts through ‘new light’ and gradually erasing faith through their constant lying, changing truth into an unfathomable mystery that can never be unraveled. The result? For the vulnerable person, though maintaining a status quo within the boundaries of the norm, it is nothing more than torment on a daily basis because they cannot see a way out, until one day, the torment of conscience and endless searching, supersedes reason and the option most restful is to accept defeat and punish themselves in the hope of finding peace with their God.

              It is not for nothing that Jehovah describes the casting out, the gnashing of teeth…and the time to grind them….the irretrievable hopelessness and the certain knowledge of retribution. Yes, the watchtower is certainly capable of inflicting this sort of mental health collapse on its people, from the ruined lives of the violated children, right through to the agony of never to be resolved effort to reason truth out of their lies. The governing body do not simply lie; they cause endless suffering and drip with blood guilt because they have made the yoke unbearable, hidden the path leading to life by misrepresenting Jehovah. It is in fact, that they deny access to the creator and the peace that brings, without which, there is nothing but despair and no end to it.

            • except the part were Jehovah himself compares it to flesh being stripped off. the WT being another word for a group of shepherds. Micah 3:3. sleeping pills dont always do the trick

            • muldoon55 .

              Man that’s a brutal way to go

            • Craig Knight

              My oldest son was speaking to an elder about all the things we were digging up about 1914 etc. He was a great guy but He wasn’t able to defend those teachings. A few weeks later He put a deer rifle in his mouth and pulled the trigger. He was a real good friend of my son. If we are going to wake someone up we need to direct them here so they don’t freak out.

            • Island Breeze

              Yes, unfortunately some our devastated to find out their living a lie.

            • how are they to go astray by hearing the truth? the lie has already made them astray. thats what a lie does, if they wish to belive it

            • Max

              That is true! My point being is that many brothers and sisters are really struggling to remain loyal. Many are just hanging from a hair before they let themselves dive into the system to be devour by satan. If we are too aggressive we might just extinguish the small flame still alive in their hearts. But I’m only talking about publishers Elders can take the heat because most of them already know the truth of the truth they just refused to accept it.

            • huh, wonder what thats like – https://e-watchman.com/smoldering-wick-will-not-snuff/

              l

            • The Raven

              Very sound reasoning, Max.

            • Cathii D’Anthonii

              That’s awesome, voice ,I hope you succeed

      • tortas

        to add insult to injury ; ive asked some jw’s for their opinion regarding the child assault cases and all of them say its fake news or vindictive ex jw’s

        • Amazing! Of course, the GB and their lawyers know better.

          • Bklyn Kevin

            I always believe that they did no better but they got caught up in the corporate world and it’s many deviant practices just like King Solomon did when he befriended the world.
            In Solʹo·mon’s old age,his wives inclined* his heart to follow other gods, and his heart was not complete with* Jehovah his God like the heart of David his father.
            Read more>
            https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/1-kings/11/#v11011001-v11011013

        • i get similar responces and treated like crap, shunned or talked with artificial talk or they try to rebuttal me trying to twist the conversation as if im wrong about something and gotta teach me better. they are not meek or humble

        • J.M.J.

          I was talking a few years ago to a couple of JEHOVAH`S witness men that I had known for a long time and they were both very calm .I spoke about the child abuse and suddenly they both got very aggressive .Said it was the news industry doing this ,and we should not pay attention to it as it is lies .I said ,but did not the WTBTS have a few people issue court orders for misquoting things that they have said and using news .They seem to want both sides of the coin .

          • Cathii D’Anthonii

            I ran into this same attitude ..My own brother who is reaching out to be an elder, called after 20 some odd years of not speaking to me..I brought up the child abuse issue and he got angry and said It wasn’t true and he had sat in on a case, and now I’m cut off again…what craziness!!!

            • J.M.J.

              I had another who got aggressive .Called me apostate ,to which I said that for one I was never baptized and for two ,what I speak has to be false .

            • Burt Reynolds

              My sister won’t speak with me for much the same reason. Mind you, she’s so grumpy she rarely speaks with others anyway, so it’s difficult to tell the difference. My sister has been reaching out to be an elder too. She’s a latter day Rutherford.

            • Cathii D’Anthonii

              You mean elderettes???they are a difficult lot, some of those sister’s study more than the elders…

            • Burt Reynolds

              Unfortunately not! She really is reaching out to be an elder…the power behind the throne. I even get a five star level of shunning from her. I can literally hear the silence from two hundred miles away. It’s as though she were standing in front of me refusing to speak!

      • The Raven

        I don’t think they’re totally brainwashed. In the most recent talk I had with a couple I asked if they noticed what was going on in the news and they said yes. I asked them what they thought about the angry posture among nations and the willingness to use “all options available” . They told me they dont discuss political matters. But this is not a political matter, it is possibly a world war. After some back and forth they admitted it looked bad but they weren’t allowed to discuss this. Man, the fear was evident as they looked at each other. I said we haven’t seen anything yet. They agreed but I am certain were too scared to go any further. I have no doubt that some of them are scared of being kicked out or shunned. The familiar refrain, “wait on Jehovah ” seemed to be a plea for release from their unquestioning servitude and blinders more than anything. I am not convinced they are all as stubborn, stupid or blind as most see them. Some of these folks are intelligent and good people. I know when the time comes some of them will do what’s right.

        • You asked them what they thought about the world’s situation and they actually said they were not allowed to talk about politics? The repressive environment is even worse then I thought.

          • The Raven

            In some cases I am certain fear of reprisals is a serious factor in this. We’ve all seen or heard of punishment and ultimately abandonment for engaging in certain matters. I can get them to agree but its a very one sided conversation. Elders will no longer speak with me. The higher up the food chain you go, the greater the fear.

          • The Raven

            As bad as it looks I remember Nicodemus.

        • Bklyn Kevin

          I don’t think they’re totally brainwashed either however I do believe they are brainwashed to the extent that they have unwavering faith in the Watchtower / governing body thus making them Blind by following man, to some degree thay have no one to blame but themselves because they have refuse to make sure of things and test every so-called inspired expression as the Bible had advised. 1Thessalonians5:21.
          Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired statement, but test the inspired statements to see whether they originate with God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world 1 John 4:1

          • The Raven

            There is also a deluding influence and when all is revealed I am certain, based on scripture that ” the third” will see. That group may also be instrumental during the days when they become escapees even to babylon, so to speak. Then we’ll also see how Moab, Edom and Ammon fare for their treatment of them. I can’t say collectively they’re all the same for following the wt at this point. Not knowing human nature and our curiosity for all things, good and bad.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Yeah I have been doing some research into the prophecies concerning Moab in reference to our previous conversation concerning the three years In respect to Babylons fall and what I found out concerning Moab is that they are to be totally destroyed with an exception of a few and the more I researched the subject the more I can conclude that Babylon the great will go down in the third year of the eight Kings reign.

            • Max

              So that would make it last almost through the whole reign of the 8 king of 3 1/2 years then.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              It appears so from what me and Raven have been researching and if this information is accurate than that causes a lot more questions which require answers.

            • The Raven

              I’d say looking at prophecy concerning them and their treatment of escapees reveals a lot. So does the admonition to witnesses; now is not the time to mention Jehovah. That as well as the warning not to prophecy again or he will be put to death, can give us a very good idea of how precarious those days will be. I mentioned a while back immediately after the sheep are scattered jws will not be distinguishable from others since the preaching stops and wt falls. During that time the harlot still exists. False religion and its many “christs” will be among the nations until the harlots death.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              So if it holds true that Babylon the great gets destroyed 6 months prior to THE END that would mean there’s a window of opportunity for some to be saved or why else would John of Patmos SAY”Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues. Revelation 18:4.Read more>
              https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/revelation/18/#v66018004

            • Max

              Oh good point Kevin. That make sence that for that reason Jehovah would end Babylon that far into the 3 1/2 year period. Jehovah in His mercy might even give them that time to repent and survive.

            • Jamie Mac

              Hi Max, Jehovah being who he is, would like all to repent, but we know many wont. Interesting conversation this one. Jehovah has hidden from us the day and the hour but has left some indicators as to the timelines once it kicks off.

            • Burt Reynolds

              3.30 on a Saturday afternoon. Get your season ticket now!

            • what is mind blowing and just unthinkable for me is that nobody of all the people who lived before the flood was worthly of life and all were so bad they were not worth saving and rehabilitating because of their wickedness and their thoughts were only bad all the time. that is just crazy to me that only one person out of all who lived to be up to over 900 years of age. a world full of people hundreds of years old had no goodness in them at all and were not good hearted to remain alive. just blows my mind. only one person found favor, only Noah. just mind boggling for me. hard to believe

            • Arvid Fløysand

              no wonder the prophet Jonah was confused when the blood-guilty city of Niniveh was pardoned …Jonah new wery well the story about the food and not only that..he also new all about how cityes like Sodom,Gomorra and later Jerico and Ai and many other cityes where totally destroyed…all living …even little children… babyes..and all living creatures…no mercy…

              That was the senario Jonah was sitting on a hill outside Niniveh and actually hoping to see…
              But nothing happend…there was no armageddon for the city of Niniveh…because they simply repented…
              Imaging the same happend to this world…how would we react ?

              We want all evil to dissapear…but just like Abraham…we ask..but what about all the children…the babyes…how can they be guilty to be killed of?…what if there is a lot of goodhearted people amoung the really bad ones…i am sure it is not our loving Creators way to let rightious people die along with the bad ones…He who notice if even a little sparrow dies…
              Our heavenly Father is just as loving and caring as Jesus is…the best and safest way to get to know who our heavenly Father and Creator is…study all about Jesus..he is the only way to real understanding of ALL things…and in him we find everything that we longing for.He made it very very easy for us…the key is love..
              The master of lie try to bring us down…satan has made humans in all history to actually belive that our heavenly Father is the bad guy…but we know better…He IS love…we know this because Jesus told us…and i for one put all my trust in his words…”Beloved ones,do not belive every inspired statement,but test the inspired statements to see wether they orginate with God….”(1 Joh.4:1)

              Good tree = good fruits
              Bad tree = bad fruits

              Shalom my friend 🙂

            • Jamie Mac

              Arvid great to see you back commenting and as always your words make so much sense and show much wisdom.

              p.s I expect you have been lurking in the background for the last month 🙂

            • Arvid Fløysand

              Hehe…yes Jamie…i am a lurker 🙂
              But my words are nothing compared to a far bigger” lurker ” that we all would love to see commenting again 😉

            • Jamie Mac

              Hi Kevin, fantastic research for us all to dive into. You said earlier, and I will quote you

              “it appears so from what me and Raven have been researching and if this information is accurate than that causes a lot more questions which require answers.”

              Is this last comment one of the questions, and what other questions do you think it might raise.?

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Well If John of Patmos Is saying “Get out of her my people – that begs the the questions.
              “How and when did they get into Babylon great ? .
              Or was his people always part of her ?.
              And if they aren’t a part of her when will they get assimilated and how?.

              For instance during the turn of the century Jehovah people supposedly have gotten out of her according to the Watchtower now if that was true why would they still be celebrating Christmas and using false worship symbols like the cross In 1926 ?.

            • The Raven

              JWs are not part of Babylon…yet. They have remained apart from all the world’s religions and steered clear of a number of other worldy ways despite their having been under a deluding influence and a MOL operating among them. The great apostasy foretold is yet to occur. After collapse and war we see the harlot riding a beast and that’s significant. In recent days the Russian federation gave a huge win to the Orthodox church over Jws by banning them and confiscating their assets. It is apparent to me that they need the support of the church in the coming days. Trump did something interesting as well by recognizing Jerusalem as the capitol of Israel much to the delight of appx 80 million evangelicals, zionists and baptists and angering the UN member states mainly in Arab nations. I see a pattern developing with these decisions. One that could come into play later. What does it mean for jws? That they’re stacking the deck. But of course they’re not able to see these things at present.
              Once the wt collapses and the sheep are scattered it becomes apparent that the remaining leadership will somehow be complicit or form an alliance or in some way permit themselves to be compromised to the point of damnation in Jehovah’s eyes. They will become full apostate and will be in direct opposition to Christ.
              In the meantime, jws will not be preaching or speaking and some will be under the leadership of the complicit wt since they are viewed as the representatives, in a spiritual sense of God’s people. The call to get out of Babylon appears to be two fold. One to jws to abandon all of the wt and those who by now have seen the truth of matters among other faiths to know that the harlot has come to her end. One of the tests for jws is the wt idol. The test for the nations is recognition of Christ and His brothers and people. Jws, “may” be held from the test of the mark by their faith whereas some among the nations will see that beast and the harlot for what they really are; demonic. It stands to reason, for this to be fair the condition of heart is what becomes the reality for folks. Those predisposed to bad will be led to destruction..those to good, will find salvation and our faith in that day will determine our outcomes. Ignorance is not an excuse since Jehovah and Christ can read hearts and minds. What we are at our core will determine what we will see and what we won’t. That’s how I understand this.

            • Burt Reynolds

              I think you are probably very right in such a hypothesis. I would argue about ignorance being an excuse though, because for that very reason, Jehovah and Christ DO read the heart! At least in my case I hope they do! I know what you mean though…

            • Burt Reynolds

              Would they just not have realised at that time that some of the celebrations such as Christmas were pagan? A bit like leaving one political party for another and not realising they are all equally corrupt? Identifying Christendom is one thing. Sweeping out all the nooks and crannies is another. On the other hand, the leadership may just have been glorifying themselves as they are apt to do, saying the had ‘got out’ and realised their mistake in this later as something and that they could no longer conceal and thus coined the ‘new light’ ploy. After all. It works very well and leaves them gleaming.

              Getting out of her, does not necessarily indicate immediacy. People ‘get out’ of a marriage and divorce over a period of years. Could it be that this getting out of her, is a realisation and a call to action, a decision to split, to get out, get away from, to stop what one is doing? We call it waking up and for many of us, that was a slow process. On the other hand, If we had been told of the child abuse, many of us would have gone the same day! So getting out may well have some huge revelation behind it to make the situation clear. Because even we, who may consider ourselves with knowledge, we are not a whole lot more worthy than they. If we have an edge on the corruption of humanity, it is through our intent to praise Jehovah, rather than to be pure in it as yet, given our human condition. Likewise for those still trapped in Babylon and/ or the watchtower.

            • The Raven

              I’d be more focused on the time that call to get out of her is made. There is an immediate urgency to flee and for my own part I’m not even considering what the WT or even christendom or anyone else has done until then. Only who heeds the call because by then, it’s a pretty much done deal other than the final prophecy, the slaughter of the anointed and Armageddon.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              When Will Jehovah’s Witnesses Go into Captivity to Babylon the Great?.Read more>
              https://e-watchman.com/jehovahs-witnesses-babylon/

              Read a lot more> Search results for: Captivity

              https://e-watchman.com/?s=Captivity

            • Cathii D’Anthonii

              Another question. .Of course we know that the preaching work stops at the fall of the wt. And the great tribulation begini, but does that we mean we cannot preach at all, or defend our faith?. Peter denied Christ three times.. The two witnesses symbolizing the anointed final message, does that mean they take all the heat?And the great crowd say nothing? It would be nice to slide through on good graces, like everyone at Bethel supposedly thinks..i see this a little differently.Jesus said our own people will turn on us

            • The Raven

              Nope. This is my reply to Burt it touches on that matter too.
              They is christendom and it’s numerous sects and denominations. It is a specific prophecy for them within the greater prophecy of the harlot
              ‘s demise which is all the world’s false religions. But even they will have a “trifling few” survive as collectively they are destroyed. It’s interesting that God’s people hide among them. Once the harlot is destroyed there will be no more hiding. Kevin and I were discussing what it may be that reveals God’s people in that day. I think it may be the fact that Jehovah pours out spirit on all of His people shortly after and then the witness of judgement begins. There’s no hiding or concealing from that point forward and scripture also supports that idea given the accounts of Jehovah telling folks what to say and they shouldn’t rehearse this. Also some will be imprisoned or even killed but not to lose hope and remain faithful even til death. This seems to go in line with much of Robert’s work on the matter as well. A lot of what I’m saying is just a rehash or a different perspective of these events. That’s mainly what Kevin and I have been discussing.

              BTW that final message is only five months til the end.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Yes the preacher work will be over at that point because their mother / Watchtower would have been silenced.

              Jehovah’s legal case against Israel (1-8)
              “However, let no man contend or reprove,
              For your people are like those who contend against a priest.
              So you will stumble in broad daylight,
              And the prophet will stumble with you, as if it were night.
              And I will silence your mother.Read more. https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/hosea/4/#v28004005

              However there will be another point in time when the call will go out for our silences to end and it’s at that point we need to muster all our faith and fear Jehovah and give him glory because the hour of judgment would have arrived for us to prove our love and Devotion to Jehovah and his kingdom by standing in the face of death and giving God’s Great Name Glory by profession his kingdom and his sovereignty thus getting out of Babylon the Great.

              And I saw another angel flying in midheaven, and he had everlasting good news to declare to those who dwell on the earth, to every nation and tribe and tongue and people. He was saying in a loud voice: “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of judgment by him has arrived, so worship the One who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and the springs of water.” Revelation 14:6-7
              .https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/revelation/14/#v66014006-v66014007

              And I heard another voice out of heaven say: “Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues.Revelation 18:4. https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/revelation/18/#v66018004

            • The Raven

              Hi Cathii. Here are a few scriptures to go along with what I stated earlier and you will also find them in Robert’s articles. That second link is acting funny but that’s an excerpt from that article I pulled from a comment I made a couple months ago.

              https://e-watchman.com/my-people-silenced/
              “So you will stumble in broad daylight, and the prophet will stumble with you, as if it were night. And I will silence your mother. My people will be silenced, because there is no knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you from serving as my priest; and because you have forgotten the law of your God, I myself will forget your sons.” —Hosea 4:5-6

              https://disq.us/url?url=https%3A%2F%2Fe-watchman.com%2Flast-days-watchtower%2F%3AJiq2SB8TLWg04kyqTsSpmsbtCeM&cuid=3652514
              “Although millions of theocratic words have been spoken and Jehovah’s Witnesses have the Bible at their fingertips, they have no knowledge of Jehovah’s judgments. Alas, once the execution of Jehovah’s judgements commences Jehovah’s Witnesses have these words of prophecy attributed to them: “And he will have to say, ‘Keep silence! For it is not the occasion for making any mention of the name of Jehovah.’” —Amos 6:10”

              This entire chapter well describes the matter.
              Zechariah 13:1-9
              13 “In that day+ there will come to be a well+ opened to the house of David and to the inhabitants of Jerusalem for sin+ and for an abhorrent thing.+
              2 “And it must occur in that day,” is the utterance of Jehovah of armies, “[that] I shall cut off the names of the idols out of the land,+ and they will no more be remembered;* and also the prophets+ and the spirit of uncleanness* I shall cause to pass out of the land.+ 3 And it must occur [that] in case a man* should prophesy anymore, his father and his mother, the ones who caused his birth, must also say to him, ‘You will not live, because falsehood is what you have spoken in the name of Jehovah.’ And his father and his mother, the ones who caused his birth, must pierce him through because of his prophesying.+
              4 “And it must occur in that day [that] the prophets will become ashamed,+ each one of his vision when he prophesies; and they will not wear an official garment of hair+ for the purpose of deceiving. 5 And he will certainly say, ‘I am no prophet. I am a man* cultivating [the] soil, because an earthling man* himself acquired me from my youth on.’ 6 And one must say to him, ‘What are these wounds* [on your person] between your hands?’ And he will have to say, ‘Those with which I was struck* in the house of my intense lovers.’”
              7 “O sword, awake against my shepherd,+ even against the able-bodied man who is my associate,”+ is the utterance of Jehovah of armies. “Strike the shepherd,+ and let those of the flock be scattered;+ and I shall certainly turn my hand back upon those who are insignificant.”*+
              8 “And it must occur in all the land,”* is the utterance of Jehovah, “[that] two parts in it are what will be cut off [and] expire;+ and as for the third [part], it will be left remaining in it.+ 9 And I shall certainly bring the third [part] through the fire;+ and I shall actually refine them as in the refining of silver,+ and examine them as in the examining of gold.+ It, for its part, will call upon my name, and I, for my part, will answer it.+ I will say, ‘It is my people,’+ and it, in its turn, will say, ‘Jehovah is my God.’”+

            • Cathii D’Anthonii

              Thank you, Raven..got it all written down

            • The Raven

              That’s how I’ve always seen this. Why give a warning if it’s all said and done by then? It implies the opportunity remains for those who are scattered and even some among Christendom or other faiths who do right by Christ’s brothers and His people, “hiding in plain sight” among other faiths during the days leading up to the call. Scripture states that Christendom will be destroyed save a “trifling few”. If I can find any scrap of evidence for salvation I’m going to mine it for all it’s worth. lol.
              We both discussed the fact that judgment is applied differently for those who call themselves Jehovah’s people and those of the nations as well as the anointed. That doesn’t matter since everyone is given the opportunity to make a decision or Jehovah would not be dealing with us fairly and never may that be true. How this comes about is a very good question and Robert has often written about it. He focuses mainly on God’s people but that doesn’t mean the world and any right hearted individuals among it are chopped liver. Look at the tests and the fact that scripture also states, “probably you may be kept from the test” for Jehovah’s people. That means others will have to undergo the test but it doesn’t mean they will fail or succeed. I can’t read more into that than is stated. Until the anointed begin the final phase of prophesying the doom of this system and all its followers, it appears at least for the nations, there are still windows open. My thinking on this matter, and it’s a leap on my part is that since the great crowd is all those who come out of tribulation that those among them who originally identified as Jehovah’s witnesses will be joined by others who wish to be among them. I do not believe it is a last minute “hail Mary” play. It is predicated on their treatment of His followers. Just as those who call themselves anointed will have had to know Jehovah before all these events take place. Not during or after since they are punished for what they have been caught doing beforehand when Christ arrives. Their judgment is a lifelong one as Paul said. That becomes evident in how Christ deals with His slaves. The judgement of His other sheep and the nations are slightly different but still fair and this is why I think there is still much to be understood about this. What’s so interesting about this all is that Robert has written a ton about these matters. Digging through this certainly does raise more questions.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Isaiah 16:14 And now Jehovah says: “Within three years, like the years of a hired worker, the glory of Moʹab will be disgraced with much tumult of every sort, and those who remain will be very few and insignificant.” https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/16/#v23016014
              Also read> Jeremiah 10: https://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/jeremiah/10/

            • Bklyn Kevin

              Raven you said” If I can find any scrap of evidence for salvation I’m going to mine it for all it’s worth. lol.

              Isaiah 25:10
              For the hand of Jehovah will rest on this mountain,
              And Moʹab will be trampled on in its place
              Like straw trampled into a pile of manure.

              Jeremiah 48:46, 47‘
              Woe to you, O Moʹab!
              The people of Cheʹmosh have perished.
              For your sons have been taken captive,
              And your daughters have gone into exile.
              But I will gather the captives of Moʹab in the final part of the days,’ declares Jehovah.
              ‘Down to this point is the judgment on Moʹab.’”

              Zephaniah 2:9
              Therefore as surely as I am alive,” declares Jehovah of armies, the God of Israel,
              “Moʹab will become just like Sodʹom,
              And the Amʹmon·ites like Go·morʹrah,
              A place of nettles, a salt pit, and a permanent wasteland.
              The remaining ones of my people will plunder them,
              And the remnant of my nation will dispossess them.

            • Bklyn Kevin

              So much more that I would like to elaborate on but it’s time for me to get to work.
              we will definitely talk later.

            • Burt Reynolds

              IT makes sense to me. But if that is the case, the need and the evidence to ‘get out of her’ must be very clear, given the short time span of six months. The Israelites had three years from 67-70. But then the world was not being blown to bits was it. It was all nice and slow in those days! Maybe that is also why we are told to get out quickly, not even picking up clothes or coming home from the field!

            • Max

              Good reasoning! The urgency given by Jesus ties up very well with the 6 month period. Interesting!

            • Jamie Mac

              I think maybe some people will have a bit longer, for instance, once the disgusting thing is put in place there will be a 3 year period up until the destruction of BTG. Of course some will realise at the time of the demise of BTG and have only a short time, others will be more discerning and be prepared. I would like to think all of use here would be part of the discerning group. Robert of course will have his work cut out during this period.

              I will be searching for one of the living anointed so I can hang on to their garment, If I am alive of course 🙂

            • Max

              True, for the witness not to be distinguishable from Babylon, Babylon needs to be still up and running so you are right Babylon most likely will fall 6 months before Armageddon. Brilliant Raven

            • The Raven

              The one thing I noticed with many who try to decipher these prophecies is they view Revelation in its entirety as a linear description of the end days. It’s not that simple. It is more like looking at a story within a story and several chapters are a brief description of the events in total, each one giving a bit more detail as well. Most of these events are occurring concurrently and John’s attention is drawn back and forth . The same is true for several of the prophets who speak about the final days and the repurchasing of God’s wayward people. It’s interesting that prophets jumped around so much and that is what led me to look a little closer. Robert does much the same thing with each article he has written, giving a clearer understanding of the over all picture but still within each one giving added details. That’s a curious way of speaking or writing I’ve noticed among many, many of the prophets. Maybe he too has been given insight to reveal these things in the same way they were originally inspired. I may be out in left field on this but it’s something I think many have noticed. Yes, he repeats himself as the prophets did. And we, who try to make sense of it find ourselves asking the same questions over and over. That’s when I realized we need a better understanding of how Jehovah wrapped these prophecies up the way he did and it becomes necessary for us to see who can unwrap them in a sensible and truthful manner. He has stated he is not a prophet. Right now there are no prophets. But… it’s obvious to us that Jehovah has given some folks the ability to untangle what is already written so we can see the truth of many matters. It does not require a prophet… Robert is correct about that. Just someone who allows Jehovah to speak and he has done that for a long time now. But even as the prophets were ignored by most save a few the “unraveler” is also ignored. It figures, doesn’t it?
              And that’s why we’re here.

            • Max

              Yes the Bible is all tangled up. It has never been an easy book to decipher. I think it has been made that way so only those with the “key “ can unlock it, and the key is the Holy Spirit. We all have the HS but not in the way some anointed have it. I think brother King will be given the privilege to be part of the special class of the Faithful and Discreet Slave a great privilege indeed to feed the rest of the holly ones and the sheeps. Good job Raven! I will be happy to call you brother in the New World.

            • The Raven

              That’s how I see it. He has revealed a great deal. I suspect even members of Bethel know these things but remain silent.
              Brother, huh? Let’s see if I can get my sorry butt to the kingdom! LOL!
              I’m trying! 🙂

            • Jamie Mac

              You already have one foot in the door Raven. Hang in there and yes you will be a worthy brother.

            • The Raven

              I owe a great deal to Robert for this site. Kevin for helping me navigate and replying to my questions and the very long discussions we’ve had lately on these matters. ( I’m wondering if he ever sleeps!)
              He will go the extra mile…no, a hundred if need be to help find answers. A resource not to be wasted or ignored. That’s how much he cares about you folks. Many people here have those same qualities. I may kid around with y’all but this is serious business and I’m happy many of you appreciate that fact. I may have a foot in the door but the other one is questionable until Jehovah slaps us all into line. I can’t take anything for granted.

            • Jamie Mac

              We cannot these these issues for granted. Rightly so as it will be a matter of life and death. Talking of kidding around, that’s a quality bestowed upon us by our creator so he must have a sense of humour too 🙂

              EDIT

              By the way your are correct about Kevin, not sure about his sleeping pattern though 🙂

            • Jamie Mac

              I don’t care how often Robert repeats things Raven , I have a terrible memory and as such I am grateful to Robert for his grand efforts.

            • The Raven

              I’m one who also found myself asking repeatedly so are others and in part it’s because we don’t fully understand a matter. But the more we explore these thing and look a little more closely at what’s here the easier it becomes to sort it out and get some of it straight in our heads. There are days, I can finish a NYT crossword puzzle in a few minutes and others when I put my truck keys in the hamper or hunt for glasses I’m already wearing.

            • Jamie Mac

              Have you ever tried to open your front door with your car keys by pressing the unlock icon. If so, you know you have had a bad day

            • The Raven

              LOL! Ok , that’s a good one!

            • Burt Reynolds

              ‘Terrible memory’ Jamie? Are you at the going to the cupboard stage and wondering what it was you went for…..or thinking ‘ I’ll remember that..’ and promptly forget it, not to mention going to the shops and forgetting your wallet. If you are, we need to join forces….

            • some people know what they went to the cupboard for but after they sit down to eat someone walks into the kitchen and says ‘what are you doing?! get out of my house’! :p

            • Jamie Mac

              Hi Dave, sorry it took so long to respond, but it completely slipped my mind

            • Burt Reynolds

              What was my question?

            • Burt Reynolds

              What was the question?

            • The Raven

              Minus appx 6 months . They go down before the final witness is given for the last five months before armegeddon. Robert also wrote about this. They will not survive to see this.

            • The Raven
            • Burt Reynolds

              Who is ‘they’ please.

            • The Raven

              Which comment of Kevin’s are you asking about? I can’t tell.

            • Burt Reynolds

              This one: our previous conversation concerning the three years In respect to Babylons fall and what I found out concerning Moab is that THEY are to be totally destroyed with an exception of a few and the more I researched the subject the more I can conclude that Babylon the great will go …. Thanks.

            • The Raven

              They is christendom and it’s numerous sects and denominations. It is a specific prophecy for them within the greater prophecy of the harlot
              ‘s demise which is all the world’s false religions. But even they will have a “trifling few” survive as collectively they are destroyed. It’s interesting that God’s people hide among them. Once the harlot is destroyed there will be no more hiding. Kevin and I were discussing what it may be that reveals God’s people in that day. I think it may be the fact that Jehovah pours out spirit on all of His people shortly after and then the witness of judgement begins. There’s no hiding or concealing from that point forward and scripture also supports that idea given the accounts of Jehovah telling folks what to say and they shouldn’t rehearse this. Also some will be imprisoned or even killed but not to lose hope and remain faithful even til death. This seems to go in line with much of Robert’s work on the matter as well. A lot of what I’m saying is just a rehash or a different perspective of these events. That’s mainly what Kevin and I have been discussing.

          • Burt Reynolds

            I don’t wish to be seen as taking a contrary view, but I feel it worth considering that in this case, many of the witnesses do look, but do not understand what they read? I know from my own experience of reading further into the scriptures quoted in the watchtower as the speaker droned on, that I simply did not understand what I read. This made me dependant. This is surely why the watchtower exerts such a strong hold. Knowledge is power. Even when it is a lie, but thought to be truth. Even today, I can read scripture and have no idea what I read. I have no insight above the basics and if Robert and others did not explain, I never would have insight. The only saving grace I seem to have is that when someone does explain the bible, reasonableness tells me what is truth and what is not, and I suppose that only comes from delight in creation because truth goes hand in hand with it. Just like a leaf when it opens, you can immediately identify the tree that bears it. So it is with ‘hearing’ the word. I think for the many who undoubtably cling to their blind stubbornness now, will come to understand visually and with their senses, above an understanding of what is now seen only through a glass darkly. It is this unveiling that will break the bond of dependancy. One has to have some greater assurance to give weight, evidence, to truth and dispel the lie. It is just as it is here, such revelations give one the faith to trust and move on.

            • The Raven

              I’ve found that to be true of some as well. It’s not exactly a one size fits all sort of thing.

      • Bonnie Russell

        I agree. It’s very easy to shut down when we find ourselves trapped physically and emotionally. To talk about it would only make it real. Ejecting from the conversation makes more sense. Otherwise we might wake ourselves up, and sometimes not knowing something is easier.

  • Isaac of Coimbatore

    Super article what a blow to Governing body? Brother Robert the last paragraph is what I like. Oh brother I am one such insignificant person who have already joined in your group.

  • Ebed Melek

    Éste articulo es demasido impresionante

    • Max

      Que es lo que mas te impresiona?

  • The Raven

    The plucking up of the three horns will undoubtedly be realized with the collapse of the United States and her supporters, probably Britain and France.

    Can this scripture be applied? It does not appear that all of the nations will willingly go along with the eighth king. I understand he will have the assets of most of the nations to use as a hammer against others. Should they not comply would it be possible he devotes them to destruction as an example to the rest? If this is applicable and the kings of these nations lie down in glory, then would it also mean they will return in the resurrection? I understand a “lengthening of life is given some which amounts to 450 days but eventually, the only one remaining is the eighth king, the king of the north all the way to his end.

    Isaiah 14:16-20
    Those seeing you will stare at you;
    They will closely examine you, saying,
    ‘Is this the man who was shaking the earth,
    Who made kingdoms tremble,q
    17 Who made the inhabited earth like the wilderness
    And overthrew its cities,r
    Who refused to let his prisoners go home?’s
    18 All other kings of the nations,
    Yes, all of them, lie down in glory,
    Each one in his own tomb.*
    19 But you are discarded without a grave,
    Like a detested sprout,*
    Clothed with the slain who were stabbed with the sword,
    Who go down to the stones of a pit,
    Like a carcass trampled underfoot.
    20 You will not join them in a grave,
    For you destroyed your own land,
    You killed your own people.
    The offspring of evildoers will never again be named.

    • Bklyn Kevin

      A good question for the podcast just a suggestion Robert.

    • Burt Reynolds

      That’s a good point….controlling the assets of the other nations. I didn’t see it that clearly before. It would be good to get further insight on this scripture.

    • They won’t have much of a choice in the matter. https://e-watchman.com/jehovahs-counsel-against-all-the-earth/

  • Burt Reynolds

    An extra 700 witnesses in the States but 500+ congregations shuttered. That’s a huge increase by anyone’s reckoning. When my children left home my wife and I sold our home and moved into a smaller one to cope with the sudden increase in children after they were gone. We manage this by rotation. When the children visit, we go out and when we come back, they leave. This way we can cope with the increase of children leaving our household. It’s the only way.

    • The Raven

      New math?

      • Burt Reynolds

        Goes well with new light, you’re right! I’ve struggled with maths all my life and it only now that I’ve realised I got the meaning of plus and minus reversed. I don’t wear glasses for nothing. Of course New Maths makes sense of the generations question and as brother Lett said about ‘more money going out than money coming in’ meaning that they actually have more money coming in from Real Estate than they are spending out on court cases using the brother’s money. I’m just so thick. Thanks for opening my eyes Raven.

        • The Raven

          Hahaha! I KNOW God loves you and so do all of us! Hahaha!

    • Jamie Mac

      How many children you got Burt?

      • Burt Reynolds

        Using New Maths, watchtower style, I have less children than I had, but more than I’ve got now.

  • Anonymous-DR

    Hi Robert. In order with the last events. Have you ever seen this? …..

    https://www.vox.com/2018/1/5/16853700/north-korea-south-talks-olympics

    • Yes. Thanks. I think that Trump is going to defuse a lot of these hot spots, especially in the Middle East, as a lead up to their saying peace and security. Then it will all blow up

      • Isaac of Coimbatore

        Brother the way you have replied is fantastic: I liked the sentence:Trump is going to defuse a lot of these hot spots, especially in the Middle East, as a lead up to their saying peace and security. Then it will all blow up
        Yeah that’s what is going to happen if anyone says peace and security.

  • Bonnie Russell

    Thought Watchman would be interested in this article. Seems the Government is prepping us for something huge.

    CDC WANTS Americans to PREPARE for NUCLEAR STRIKE:
    https://gizmodo.com/the-cdc-wants-to-prepare-americans-for-a-nuclear-strike-1821807420

    • I tweeted that a few days ago. But thanx anyway. ;~)

  • PCDN

    Oh how I envy those who have fallen asleep rather than going through this 😥

  • e.v.g

    During the time of the end there will be no preaching work, there will be no time for understand and assimilate God’s will or the bible, outside in the world there are many people like beasts or worst than that, the issue about the independence of the man from God will be resolved. But more important the fidelity of the sons of God will be tested. This is more important than a religion or a family member including the very lives of them.

    • Isaac of Coimbatore

      What you said is correct and exactly correct that is what Hab:3:17 supports your comment. Good point! e.v.g good point! This what I have exactly interpreted and see if it is helpful for you.
      HAB: 3:17: Although the fig tree may not blossom, And there may be no fruit on the vines; Although the olive crop may fail, And the fields may produce no food; Although the flock may disappear from the pen, And there may be no cattle in the stalls;
      Why would we ever feel worried like Habakkuk about fig tree, vines olive, crop failing, food, flock and cattle? Because the world in which we live we don’t even go to field and work like farmers still we get food. Tough crops may fail we have genetically modified rice to produce more food for short period of time even with very less water and we have Monsanto (Satanic Company) like companies to destroy pests (and give cancer). So who is bothered if flock in the pen and cattle in the stall are not there? For example I don’t drink coffee and tea and Brahmins and Jains will not bother about flock and cattle because they are vegetarians. Was Habakkuk speaking about great tribulation when we all will have food shortages and even though he won’t get food for living still he will exult in Jehovah; and be joyful in great tribulation?
      If Habakkuk is talking about food shortages why is he giving a big list such as figs, fruit on the vines, olive, crop, food, flock and cattle just to fill the pages in the bible. He could have just said: Bread, oil, wine and water.
      Now you apply the symbols given in Hab: 3:17 with the appropriate equivalent meanings taken from the Bible itself and see how it relates:

      Although the matured anointed ones who were in truth for long time may (fig tree was not blossom refer Hoes:9:10) not be able to give their support for preaching work due to great tribulation, and because of that there are no disciples produced by the anointed ones (no fruit on the vines refer John:15:1,5 and Rev:14:18) although the (olive crop refer Zech:4:12 and 14) anointed ones may fail in doing their ministry and because of the great tribulation the preaching work and digging of the spiritual food (researching) from the bible will be stopped that will result in not feeding the spiritual food for the flocks and (fields may produce no food refer 1st Corinthian:3:9) although this may cause the members (= flock refer 1st Peter:5:2) to disappear from the congregation (= the pen refer John:21:17) And there may be (no cattle in the stalls refer Gen:13:2 ,21:7 30:43, 26:14, Job:1:3 and 42:12 2nd Chron:7:5, 1st Kings:8:63) no possession (due to global financial collapse) in the congregation to sacrifice for Kingdom work; Yet the prophet says that even though the Christ’s congregation is in such a desolate condition (as prophesied by Daniel and Revelation) he will exult in Jehovah and be joy full in the God of my salvation, because the Sovereign LORD Jehovah is strength;(referring to Isaiah:12:1).
      Does it not make sense?

  • Isaac of Coimbatore

    ATTENTION PLEASE EVERYONE
    DID YOU SEE Life and Ministry Meeting March:19-25
    It discusses Mat:24th chapter
    Under Digging for Spiritual Gems of that week: Life and Ministry Meeting work book
    It deliberately avoids asking questions on Holy place. Have anyone of you noted?
    Just think WHY? Is WTS going to change its view on Holy place? May be or may not be

    I have written an article on THE HOLY PLACE TO BE DESOLATED in a more profound manner referring
    from Bible verses.

    If anyone wants contact easajw@gmail.com

    I am going to answer on that week what I did from my own research and from Roberts website.
    Even thought they did not asked about holy city I am going to answer for the question
    What other spiritual gems have you discovered in this week’s Bible reading?

    Also please note how you are going to answer for this weeks Mat:4th to 5th chapter
    I am going to connect Mat:4:5: Then the Devil took him along into the holy city,
    and he stationed him on the battlement of the temple. With that of anointed ones being tested
    and tempted and Satan in the holy city and on the battlement of the temple refers to
    Satan influence on the congregation over the anointed ones and I will connect that to
    2nd Thes: 2 chapter of man of lawlessness.

    Hey its going to be Ducolax tablets for them.

  • muldoon55 .

    Again Robert you display an uncanny ability to decipher prophecy in a logical coherent ring of truth way. Amazing how the org can’t see these prophecies the way you do

    • Isaac of Coimbatore

      Answer see Isaiah: 42:19

  • Revv_zone@gmail.com Please8834

    Check out what could be the “Locust Hordes” of Revelation.swarm-home-made-drones-strike-military-base-first-attack-kind-russia-uavs

    • Yeah, I saw that and was thinking the same thing. The thing is, those ISIS drones were homemade out of plywood, albeit with sophisticated guidance systems, no doubt provided by the US. I would imagine China could crank out zillions of killer drones if they haven’t already

      • Revv_zone@gmail.com Please8834

        I nearly bought a drone last year that’s can be seen at http://www.Mavic Pro.com it can fly 45 mph up to 4miles and last 30 mins gyrocam , very cool but could be used as a Deadly Device for certain. , can be converted into killers as you say no problem.

        • Isaac of Coimbatore

          Really? Cost? I would suggest my university to buy one for aeronautical department.

  • Flynn Leonard
  • Flynn Leonard
  • Flynn Leonard
  • Flynn Leonard
  • Flynn Leonard
  • Arvid Fløysand

    Hello all who love the fruit from the good tree 🙂
    It is beautyful poscard-like winter in Norway where i live…lot of fluffy clean white snow…soo bright with sunshine at day and moonshine soo clear that you can see shaddows from trees but still be able to count stars….

    When i woke up this morning it was a lot of new snow on the ground…i jumped in my boots and went outside and notised somone had already been walking in the snow before me…it was my old fathers footsteps and it made old memories come to my mind…so i started to walk presicely in my fathers footsteps just like i used to do when i was a little kid…later in the evening i decided to walk in my fathers footsteps again but it became rather difficult because it was already dark and many others had been walking in all directions so i had to consetrate very hard to follow only my own fathers footsteps…not easy you know,but i will urge everyone to give it a try 😉

    and belive it ore not but january is in fact the perfect time to cut and trim appletrees 🙂

    So i have been busy looking after all my appletrees…four different types of appletrees and a fifth is on its way…but they are still small an wont have apples on them on this side of armageddon i guess …
    Sadly one big tree that used to be a good one became sick this atum…i tryed to rescue it by cutting of infected brances…only to find out that the sourse of the illness came from its own root…so i will let it stand for a little while longer,just because i know i will miss it when its gone…but to save the other appletrees,i will have to take it down early in the spring and burn it to avoid further damage…

    I guess i have to give more attention to the remaining trees then in order to get about the same amount of apples as i am used to get…:-)

    Anyway…winterseason has its beauty…the nature rest peacefully..but i alwayes look foreward to the busy but wonderful spring…even though ive seen the spring coming over and over again after a cold winter all my life,it still amazes me how the whole nature coming back from the dead and almost explode of life…
    All the colours ,flowers,insects…my fateful honeybees and many little lambs jumping around …i love it..

    One day the “winter” of this world is all gone…

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